MR. KOJO NNAMDIFrom WAMU 88.5 at American University in Washington, welcome to the "Kojo Nnamdi Show," connecting your neighborhood with the world. Last night, I couldn't stop thinking about today's show and found it hard to fall asleep. There was a faucet dripping in the bathroom and the wind was howling outside my window. And just as I started to drift off, a cricket started to chirp and then a car screeched to a halt out on the street and then -- and then -- okay, so none of this actually happened.

MR. KOJO NNAMDIThe truth is that I've got Fred Newman in the studio with me today. If you're a fan of a "Prairie Home Companion," then you know Fred Newman, one of the sound effect guys who can mimic crying babies, buzzing mosquitoes and trumpeting elephants, all with one simple tool, his mouth. Newman says his goal is to create auditory Q-tip sounds that bring us back to unique memories in our own lives and he's made a living doing so for 30 years now. Fred Newman is an award winning writer, actor, sound designer and musician. As I mentioned, you can hear him performing on public radio's a "Prairie Home Companion" and on the PBS children's show, "Between the Lions," among others.

MR. KOJO NNAMDIHis book on sound effects back in '98 first wrote it is called, "Mouth Sounds." Fred Newman joins us in studio.

MR. FRED NEWMANHi.

NNAMDIHow can a grown man make a living doing all these childish things?

NEWMANYou know, the sounds are the easy part. That's the scam. The real art of it is actually getting paid to do that.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANIt's, you know, sound design is now gone so much with computers and you just drop in cards and real sounds. There's only one show that I know in the world that still wants it to be real and live and spontaneous and that's, "Prairie Homes." So I just -- when I did the book, "Mouth Sounds," in 1980...

NNAMDIThat was even before you started at "Prairie Home."

NEWMANThat was before. But one of the first shows I was on in 1980 was this new show that had just been syndicated on public radio and it was "Prairie Home Companion." I went and did that baby voice. I didn't know enough. You don't surprise a host by just walking in, but I walked in and he said, Fred Newman, author of "Mouth Sounds" and he introduced me. And I went, hi, my name is baby Elizabeth, just to him. And Garrison said, oh, well, you're a big girl sit in my lap. And I sat in his lap and played a blues song on a harmonica, but he totally rolled with it. I said, I'll follow this guy anywhere. He is so good at improvisation. And years later, 20 years later when Tom Keith, who's been with him for years and is still there, does the shows in St. Paul -- he decided not to travel. Garrison left me a message on my machine to call him and I've been there now 10 years doing all the travel shows.

NNAMDIWell I'm glad you mentioned Tom Keith because at some point in this broadcast, we're going to hear a sound off between you and Tom Keith. But before that, the phrase auditory Q-tips is one that you mentioned in an interview with the New Orleans Times Picayune. Talk a bit about what kind of response you're trying to get from an audience with the sounds you make.

NEWMANYou know, I've been awed by the power of sound and I grew up with story tellers in Georgia. Most of these guys were black guys, but they would crank cars and throw cats out windows and do a water drip like you heard. You hear that at six and you start listening. I just had this gift, this wonderful gift of sounds early on. With the onslaught of sound -- well, we actually carry around our sound environments in our pockets now by -- orchestrate our sound with our iPods and so forth.

NEWMANSounds are -- there are so many sounds. Just when synthesizers came in, there's so much more sound around us. We really don't pay attention to those crickets at night. We don't pay attention. And by stripping it down and doing something like, Garrison talking like this and in the background, there are (makes noise) you pull it back down and everyone starts to listen again. That's what we've been doing for 30, 40,000 years, crouching around some kind of fire.

NEWMANIt may be a radio or television, but radio, in particular, is so good at storytelling and nobody does it better than public radio.

NNAMDIIn case you're just joining us, we're talking with Fred Newman. He's the award-winning writer, actor, sound designer and musician you hear performing public radio's a "Prairie Home Companion," and the PBS children's show, "Between the Lions," among others. You can call us if you'd like to join the conversation. If you've got questions for Fred at 800-433-8850 or you can go to our website, kojoshow.org, join the conversation there.

NNAMDII'm glad you mentioned growing up because there isn't exactly a college degree in sound effects, is there? You first started learning this art growing up as a child in La Grange, Ga. Is there a southern state that doesn't have a town named La Grange?

NEWMANNo. I mean...

NNAMDII can't think of one.

NEWMANNo. There's a La Grange in Connecticut and Ohio.

NNAMDIAnd Illinois, too.

NEWMANYeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was -- Lafayette traveled around a lot and I think it was -- La Grange, he named a lot after his farm. We just name it La Grange and the people named it that.

NNAMDITell us about your childhood.

NEWMANGrew up right on the edge of a town, a small town and -- but it was a great sound of (word?) . My grandfather had a farm, you know, sort of poked cattle and that sort of thing. But it was -- you know, chickens and dogs. But this sound environment was what was so interesting because it just -- I do remember television from the get-go. I was born in '52. But, you know, being out and, you know, (makes noise) momma, somebody's coming up the driveway, you know, that we would -- that sounds were opportunities. You know, they weren't the intrusions they are now and it was a definitely a quieter, gentler time.

NEWMANReally interesting place because what was going on in Selma and Georgia and Atlanta -- when I was a freckled face, snaggle-toothed kid sitting on a big coke box listening to this guy named Jack Fling. It was a little grocery store on Country Club Road so you know it's the white side of town. But Hard Bite, Red Line Alley, which was former slave cabins servants quarters -- Black Street on the white side of town and this store is right there. Blacks and whites mixed in this store to have Coca-Colas and Big Oranges and Ne-his. And there was a -- I got to get southern when I tell this. But, you know, there's a fan that pushes hot air around and around and around. Actually, I did that and realized I'm moving my head like a fan.

NNAMDIYes. You're moving your head like a fan. You should see him.

NEWMANAnd Jack Fling would unwind stories. There were all these guys would tell stories and they would do (makes noise) why they made this dis soda, man that thing was fantastic. You know, they would tell these stories and this was the best.

NNAMDIThe phrase you used came from back then, unwinds the story for you. What's that about?

NEWMANWell you've heard of a yarn? Telling a yarn? Well, it is like a ball of yarn. You sort of unwind a story and it never unwinds the same 'cause it's never wound up the same. So it always comes out as a performance, a live performance. And I think that part of sound that Garrison subscribes to is that it's a live piece of jazz. That storytelling has to be done live. It's not canned. It's not on a CD, it's -- you're going through it in real time. So that part of it, there's a energy. And the fact that my lips right now are about a -- maybe an inch and a half from this microphone, that's what his voice is. That's what radio does that television can't do. It has that intimacy. And to be in real space across the table, that's the real way stories should be told, across the table.

NEWMANNow, this wasn't across the table, but everybody's eating peanuts and drinking Coca-Cola and sitting around...

NNAMDIUnwinding stories.

NEWMAN…unwinding stories. That's right.

NNAMDIDo you remember the first sound effect you ever learned how to make?

NEWMANThe one I’m told, and I still do it, was the sound of my mother's shoes on a wood floor when she came over to the bed. This is before I -- (makes noise) now that's not a great sound. And why she was wearing army boots is unclear (makes noise) but the first real sound that I was taught was a water drip. And that was taught by this guy named Snipes. He was probably 90 years old and there was a water drip into a nail -- big old bucket. And he said, look at that water drip. Look at that. Watch it come down. It's not like...

NNAMDIYou should see how I'm staring at his lips when he's saying this.

NEWMAN...it's not like a soft drip. The thing's like a bullet. And it goes down and hits the top of that water. "Boom," it blows a hole it. "Bop," it blows a hole in it. You can see the crater and he said, look at it. And I looked at it and you could see it go down, the water would open up and it would start closing up. He said, it closes up like lips, like a bag it pushes that air back out and makes a little whistle. So you can do that. All you do is go -- a pop on the cheek like that and then you blow the water out. (makes noise)

NNAMDIThat, in itself, is a fascinating story unwinding.

NEWMANYeah, well, that's these guys. I was probably five years old, four years old when he showed me that and was like, oh, there's a world that opened. This guy, he could do lawn mowers (makes noise) . He could do a whole bunch -- what do you call it? It's not a covey. It's not a herd. It's a bunch of dogs. Coon hunting. They call it raccoon hunting. (makes noise) . He would do multiple sounds. He would do a whole swamp. (makes noise) He would do all these things. And you see that, you know, it's not about making the sounds, it's about getting them in.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANIt's about listening. It is all about listening because we imitate.

NNAMDIThe sounds are a part of the story. But how did this go from hobby to career for you?

NEWMANWell, it was not a straight route at all. I mean, I went to the University of Georgia, did economics and art. A lot of -- did metal casting and metalwork. I was a black smith in Finland for a while and worked with a carpet company. And then, I went to Harvard Business School. I thought -- yeah, then I went to Newsweek magazine. I worked there a couple of years. And while I was there, I was doing a little standup comedy.

NEWMANAnd I was more a storyteller so it wasn't like, you know, the jokes per second were coming out. But I would tell these stories and I realize that, you know, you go (makes noise) and people sit up and stop smoking and look. You know, and that's what you got to do to get their attention. And people say, how did you do that sound? And I realized, this isn't a folk art, this is the way sounds were -- I mean, stories were told especially in the south.

NEWMANAnd it's part of Irish tradition, Scots tradition and in the black tradition. And you put those together and you got this sort of magic crucible going on down there in Georgia. All those Uncle Remus stories, all those things I heard growing up. And I realized, I can write a book about how to make the sounds because I always taught people. So I did that years ago...

NNAMDI"Mouth Sounds."

NEWMAN..."Mouth Sounds," and I did a -- you know, that was 75 sounds. Now, there's a new book of it that's about 300 sounds. Now, it comes with, you know, you've got videos and you got other things I can teach you with. But that's really where it came from. And it's all about listening.

NNAMDIThat was in La Grange, Georgia. Now, you live in New York City and it's my understanding that in a city that is so replete with sounds, you ride your bike around the city without a helmet. This has nothing to do with safety.

NEWMANHow did you know that? How did you know that?

NNAMDIIt has everything to do with so you can hear the city sounds better.

NEWMANHow did you know that?

NNAMDIWe do our research.

NEWMANNo one's ever asked -- known about that. I don't tell that because the people -- they're so politically incorrect about that.

NNAMDIOh, yeah.

NEWMANBut, no, I don't want to cover my ears at all or cover up -- I've got to hear that. And I stop -- I will hear a sound or hear an accent, I will follow that. I stalk them. I want to hear how they make that R sound. What is that? I'm always listening, yeah. Yeah.

NNAMDIIf you were to take us an auditory tour of your New York neighborhood, what are some of the sounds we might hear?

NEWMANWe now live in the 9th floor up on 106th Street, and that's a double wide street where buses go by. And we didn't know. If you're renting in New York City, go to that apartment at night before you rent it because we didn't realize there's a fire station just down the street.

NNAMDIExactly.

NEWMAN(makes noise) That's going on. There's a bus, cross town bus that goes right across there. So there's (makes noise), that's the lowering, and then (makes noise). And you've got the snow plows and you've got a lot of (makes noise) dogs. And...

NNAMDIHow do you sleep at night if you don't have those accompanying sounds when you go to La Grange, Georgia for a visit?

NEWMANYou know, I don't sleep so well in New York. My wife sleeps like a log. "Boom," she's out. I like the country. And we have a little place, a little house in Connecticut that -- out there, it's, you know, it's really noisy. The geese are not -- right now, they're just coming through you, (makes noise). It sounds like the Met's parking lot in the morning. I mean, it's (makes noise). And there are territorial fights going on. And there's a -- we have a blue heron out there right now, (makes noise). We always do this pterodactyl on the show. That's -- it's the blue heron is what I'm doing. They are, like, prehistoric, those things. So I'm always listening to those sounds.

NNAMDIYou wrote the first edition of your book, "Mouth Sounds," that we've been talking about early in 1980. How has the world of sound changed in the 30 years since then?

NEWMANI would call that a great question. That's a great question. I mean, when I rewrote the book, things like -- before, it was how to dial a phone, which is (makes noise). That's so long ago. When I even -- the book came out maybe three, four years ago, that even then, people knew that -- now they have no idea. Even kids don't know how to put their finger in and, you know, they take it back out, they get it caught in the -- you know, (makes noise), you know, that's really changed.

NNAMDIOh, yeah.

NEWMANBut then portable sound, the portability of sound and that whole revolution, that's changing everything. When you can, you know, if I want to know who you are, I will look at your iPod. That would tell me more about who you are.

NNAMDIThe sounds.

NEWMANThe sounds, the music you're listening to. Just like those radio dials that always tell you -- it's not how you vote, it's where you are on the radio dial that tells you who you are.

NNAMDIIt really does.

NEWMANThe sonic tribe that we belong to is so key. And it's been this way for tens of thousands of years, but now we can control -- in a way, if you dip into other people's tribes and listen to that and, you know, I find the sound -- when synthesizers came in, that changed all of music. We're back from that now, but now there's loops. We're in a little restaurant down here, (makes noise) this (makes noise) music going on in the background and it's just loops. Music has changed where they have this sort of mass -- it's almost like music, but it's like hip and jazzy. You know, jazz, (makes noise) and it's in the background of Starbucks or whatever.

NNAMDISo that's how it's changed.

NEWMANThe ever-present -- you can't go a place now without music around. You know, the tunes that go in the -- are going in the grocery, even the freezer section is like, you know, it's like, (makes noise) funky town.

NNAMDIThat's right.

NEWMANYou know, it's -- you go -- even on the street. It's spilling out everywhere that -- it's ever present. That we don't have silence much anywhere. And we are not used to -- we're uncomfortable with that.

NNAMDIYou mentioned that music. I walked into the Whole Foods, the next thing I was walking back through my youth. All of these songs that were popular when I was a teenager are coming out of the Whole Foods.

NEWMANThat's exactly right.

NNAMDIMany people know you best from "Prairie Home Companion." But that's not all you do. It's my understanding you recently worked on an exciting and challenging project for the National Park Service.

NEWMANOh, yeah.

NNAMDIWhat did the federal government need you to do in Yellowstone?

NEWMANI just -- this is one of the coolest things ever. They wanted me to do the sound of Old Faithful. Now, you'd think Old Faithful does that pretty well and she or he does, but they wanted five miles below. And this is for the New Visitor Center. So I did the sound of magma five miles below. And then, eight levels up, what happens to give the sonic representation of a graphic that you slide across and you go up through the level to see what happens to make a geyser.

NEWMANAnd there -- they have more geysers in any other place in the world. And it was such an interesting thing. The way I -- and they wanted to get it done with the mouth. These are kind of like wood cuts -- there's a beautiful display. It's about nine, 10 feet tall. And I watched kids go through this and adults. And as they move the slider across, how do I make the sound of magma? Oh, and they actually -- when I talked to the park service, they said, well, well, can't you just record that? And I went, well, no, it's five miles down and probably 10, 12,000 degrees. Is that a problem? Yeah, yeah, it's a problem getting there and then recording it.

NEWMANSo I said, it's all metaphor. Sounds, when you do sound design, you're really doing metaphors for -- so you connote the sound. What I did is I took two granite blocks, cobblestones and I moved them across and heard that (makes noise) I heard that sound. And I imitated that sound and then I took into a computer -- the only one that I used a computer on was the lowest level. And then I took it down eight octaves so that that (makes noise), it went -- you know, I should have brought a copy of that.

NNAMDIYeah, yeah, yeah.

NEWMANIt shouldn't -- I probably have one on my iPod here. But to hear that eight levels below (makes noise) and then up in the air, it's easier because you're going (makes noise). And when the gas is contained, the steam is (makes noise). Then it (makes noise). You know, but we go up the levels with that.

NNAMDIReid's (sp?) provided a link, you should know, to their online visitor's center where they can actually hear that there. So you didn't have to bring it on your iPod.

NEWMANOh, fantastic.

NNAMDIThey can actually find the sounds there. We are talking with Fred Newman. If you want to talk about sounds, Fred Newman is who you talk to. He's an award-winning writer, actor, sound designer and musician who's heard generally on this station on the "Prairie Home Companion," but he's also on the PBS children show, "Between the Lions," and a lot of other things. His book on sounds effects is called, "Mouth Sounds." We'll be taking a short break to take care of some business. When we come back, we will continue our conversation with Fred Newman. As a matter of fact, maybe during that short break, we should have background music. I kind of like that idea. I'm Kojo Nnamdi.

NNAMDIIt’s the third day of our fall membership campaign here at WAMU 88.5. We have a goal this hour that managing producer of the show, Diane Vogel, is on hand to inform us about it. But even before that, you should know that you should call, 202-885-8850 to help us reach that goal and become a member. During the course of this broadcast, we'll be having background music provided by Fred, 202-885-8850. Here's Diane.

MS. DIANE VOGELKojo, we're doing pretty well, but I know everybody is enjoying listening to Fred. And maybe I could get a drum roll. We've got $5,500 goal and so far $3,743 to go.

NEWMAN(makes noise)

VOGELYou can do it, though. I have no doubt. We know that you are the most significant part of our radio station, whether you are listening, whether you are calling in, whether you are dialing to donate money. What's important is that you are here every day. You rely on WAMU and we rely on you. So put a value on how important WAMU is in your life. Make a contribution at $10 a month, $20 a month or a one-time $60 donation, whatever fits in your budget, that's what matters. We just want to hear from you, 202-885-8850, 202-885-8850 or wamu.org.

NNAMDIThe art of conversation is alive and well on WAMU 88.5 Public Radio. Our talk shows are challenging yet civil, intelligent yet down to earth. Financial support from members has made that all possible. Now, it's your turn to call 202-885-8850 or go to our website, wamu.org. Make your contribution there. Challenging, civil and fun. One of the things we have, every Wednesdays we have Food Wednesdays and we took a long time discussing whether or not we should have Food Wednesdays until we discovered it was, well, a no-brainer because everybody loves to eat and everybody likes to talk about eating.

NNAMDISo if you appreciate the fact that we offer this kind of variety in our programming here, such as Food Wednesdays, Tech Tuesdays, the Politics Hour, you can call us at 202-885-8850. And as proof that we like to have fun, we have our background musician, our background sound effects guy here with us today. Fred Newman is on-hand.

NEWMAN(makes noise)

NNAMDIIf you appreciate the sound effects, call us, 202-885-8850. Our volunteers are standing by.

VOGELYou know, Kojo, whether you're talking with Fred Newman about sound effects or whether you're talking to an assistant secretary of state. We know each day we're going to get something fascinating when we turn on the dial to "The Kojo Nnamdi Show." You can learn about who's getting security clearances these days and who's not. You can learn about the taxi cab issues in your neighborhood. All of those things, plus you can learn how to make that cricket noise or how to make those honking noises.

VOGELI know that you enjoy listening to WAMU. I know you have a button on your dial set for it every day. If you do, now is the time to step up and call 202-885-8850, 202-885-8850. And, Kojo, if we were -- if the phones were ringing, we'd be hearing them in our headphones and we're not hearing them. So please make them ring.

NNAMDIKeep those phones ringing, 202-885-8850.

NEWMANCan I jump in for one second?

NNAMDIPlease jump in, Fred Newman.

NEWMANYou know what? The thing I've been a public radio listener for a long, long time -- because they are the best storytellers.

VOGELMost definitely.

NEWMANAnd when I'm out there, I actually go -- when I do tours and things, people -- the other radio stations, they are imitating what you guys do because they are giving data.

VOGELMm-hmm.

NEWMANThere is just information that doesn't -- is not contextualized, is not laid out in the story with sound effects. And that's the way -- when you spin the dial and tell who you are by what you listen to, when you spin the dial, you know when you're on a public radio station.

VOGELYou can hear it.

NEWMANAnd you know when you hear it, you hear the energy. You know it's real people talking to you very intimately. Everything here is that way, very different. Hello, everybody, that Hillary Clinton, I tell you, she's just -- you know, you're either the (makes noise) hey, welcome back, we are (unintelligible) coming at you. You know, that's what you hear down the dial. This, you know what you get here and it's worth contributing to.

NNAMDIIt's a shout-free zone here at WAMU 88.5 where you can listen to conversations, even if those conversations are about sounds and sound effects themselves. We'd like to think that that's why you value WAMU 88.5. We are asking you to make a contribution to that value by calling 202-885-8850 and becoming a member now.

VOGELAnd, Kojo, I have sad news about last hour. We missed the goal by about 800. So I don't want you to think that you can just sit back and that somebody else will make that call for you. There is nobody out there wearing a label called somebody. You are the somebody. Mary, that's you. Tim, that's you. Jennifer, that's you.

NEWMANThat's me? Oh, my goodness.

VOGELAnd, of course, Fred, that's you. But please, make that call now. If you can do $50 a month, great. If you can do a one-time donation of $50, that's fine, too. If you can do $1,000, you can get two-day sponsorships. It doesn't really matter the amount, what matters is that you become part of our Kojo Nnamdi community, 202-885-8850. And thank you.

NNAMDIHe's unwinding stories today with us. He is Fred Newman, the award-winning writer, actor, sound designer and musician. You often hear him performing on public radio's "The Prairie Home Companion" and on the PBS children's show, "Between the Lions." But there are several others and his book on sound effects is called "Mouth Sounds," I'd like the idea of unwinding stories, but allow me not to dominate the conversation. Here's Tripp in Dundalk, Md. Tripp, your turn. Go ahead, please.

TRIPPYes, thanks a lot, Kojo. Hello, Fred.

NEWMANHey, Tripp.

TRIPPI admire you for being able to make a living out of that. It's a gift because I can't make noises. I'd like to. But I love sounds, katydids, cicadas...

NEWMANYeah, yeah.

TRIPP(word?), those frequencies...

NEWMAN(makes noise)

TRIPP...are one of my favorites and high frequencies.

NEWMANMm-hmm.

TRIPPBut it seems that when I mention this to other people, they don't know what I'm talking about. It's like either they just -- their auditory sense is just so underappreciated. And I have a question for you.

NEWMANYes.

TRIPPI have a friend and acquaintance of mine who was in an earthquake in Turkey and he went into just all the horror of it. And after he described it, I said, well, what did it sound like? And his eyes got kind of blank and he says, I don't remember. Why do you think that is that people doesn't seem to have any appreciation to sound?

NEWMANYou know, you're exactly right. There's a tide that's turning now. But seeing is believing, but hearing is feeling. The hearing comes in for different -- we have a huge amount of brain space for visually dominated spheres. But sound comes in way down close to the brainstem. And that's why when someone wants to scare you, they don't just -- "boo." It's the "boo" that gets you. It's not just standing there. It's the "boo." I do a lot of sound design, things like low frequency sounds. If you're watching "24" or "House," or whatever, when you hear (makes noise) everyone feels uncomfortable. It's very subliminal.

NEWMANIt's almost like the fish in the water is not aware of the water. We are so much in a sound sphere all the time. We have that around our heads, but we don't have words for it. Even if you are doing -- and as an actor, you're being directed to use your voice. Brighten that, or, I need a lighter voice. All the words, they're not -- they're about light, but they -- we don't have the words for sound. We don't have the -- it's very difficult for -- sound and emotions are so intertwined that we don't talk about them or notice them, but they are a huge part of who we are.

NNAMDIYou know, when Tripp mentions the sounds of an earthquake in Turkey...

NEWMANYeah.

NNAMDI...we had an earthquake in the Washington area recently. We don't get them a lot. It was my first experience of an earthquake in this region and it sounded like heavy machinery in my basement grinding together. And I actually got up knowing that there was no heavy machinery in my basement and started heading down to the basement to see what the heavy machinery down there was doing. But that's what the earthquake kind of felt like to me and I don't know you can represent that in sound.

NEWMANIt's -- you know, the sound -- low frequency sounds are used a lot in sound design because of the uncomfortability. Animals notice this a lot. As you know, the tsunami...

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMAN...elephants hear through their feet. I don't know if you knew that. But they...

NNAMDINo, I didn't.

NEWMAN...they're the only animals whose toenails are connected to the bones. And they lean forward and they can detect elephants as far away as 16 miles away through their feet. The ears are not really for hearing. Those are radiators. That's why they flap those big ears to get rid of -- they go the wrong way. Think about it. Like a dog's, they go forward. No these -- their ears are cupped...

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMAN...backward to their heard and they hold them out. They're for signaling, but they actually emit a sound through their forehead. The sound -- the way animals use sound, and we use it too, it is so much a part of, like, you know, your accent, that tells who you -- where you were born and it stays with you. No less than bird calls. We have this signature that we grow up in the sound sphere that we take with us and we adapt with music and so forth.

NEWMANIt is -- it's always been the ugly stepchild, especially with television. And remember, you had these big televisions, big old -- before the flat screens.

NNAMDISure.

NEWMANBut you had a three-inch oval speaker.

NEWMANOh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

NEWMANYou've got a huge screen, but now, just about everyone, even on the computers at home, they have these stereo speakers.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANAnd you have the surround sound. So there is good news that people are beginning to notice sound. That they noticed that, oh, that bird that flew from left -- not just left to right, but over your head diagonally. They can now put that into movies.

NNAMDIIt's so funny because many years ago, I read about Ray Charles 30 years ago saying he hated working for television because there were these little tiny speakers that you created...

NEWMANYes.

NNAMDI...all of these wonderful sounds. And then, when you heard it out of this speaker, it sounded like nothing that you'd created. Recently, you've been drawn to something called binaural sound. What is that and why do you find it so intriguing?

NEWMANYou know, binaural sound was invented in Germany in the '30s, I do believe. And it's -- actually, you record with microphones in the ears of a dummy. If you put hair on the dummy, it's even better. Because what you do, just like 3-D, like stereoscopic vision, the movies that are happening now, if you record that way, the difference between a snap behind your head, you hear that, or a snap in front of you. Not just left and right, but you heard it in behind you and in front of you.

NEWMANIt encodes it the same way. The timing delay is between the ears and you actually have ears that act like filters for the sound. When you play it back, either hard left and hard right or with earphones, you'll hear that. I've been doing some things with Between the Lion. It's a phonics show for kids, and it's on public television. It's kind of the show that comes after Sesame Street chronologically. Where Sesame Street is numbers and letters, this is words -- reading and pre-reading and sounds.

NEWMANAnd there's puppets and animation. You can't see the lips of those puppets and, you know, so they need a human. So we had to do this really close and I put a binaural head there. So I lean -- let me telling you something -- and I come in real close. When I lean forward, the focus group showed kids lean forward because they -- it's not a (sic) malavalier like, you know, Regis Philbin, he's -- okay, kids out there -- it's not...

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMAN...and when you move around, it doesn't -- it doesn't move with you. But binaural, when you move around, and this -- if we did it here, you would hear me come in and you would hear me go -- not just left and right, but you could hear -- when I will disappear off the camera...

NNAMDIMm-hmm.

NEWMAN...kids will look down below where I went off to the left or diagonally. So they hear this...

NNAMDINot just kids, I would, too.

NEWMAN... yeah, well, psycho-acoustically, it's a very accurate thing. And now, we have the ability to produce that in both, you know, on the internet, it -- it broadcasts beautifully. So I've been very excited because it -- when you say, you know, you whisper something, you really -- they really notice it. And it's almost like Garrison's voice being so close. It's like the Q-tips you mentioned earlier. It's like Q-tips. It cleans your ears. You really listen.

NNAMDIYou can find links at our website to "Between the Lions" where you see some of that in evidence. We got an e-mail from Susan in D.C. who says, "If I'm like many 30-somethings, my first memory of Fred Newman is from "Sesame Street." Today, I share Fred with my children on "Between the Lions." Please have Fred talk about his early days with Big Bird and Elmo. And please, can Fred provide a few tips for making me a cool mom?

NNAMDIThat is, can he teach me how to make cool sounds I could teach to my sons this afternoon when they come home from school?" And another e-mail from Inez in Bowie, Md. "I understand some of your earliest work was with our local hero, Jim Henson, creator of the Muppets. Do you have a favorite story or two about Jim and the Muppets that you can share?"

NEWMANWow, yeah. I did work with Jim Henson and, you know, I was a lousy puppeteer. Actually, Jim Henson, who was the nicest man in the world, he -- he said, you know, you're really a lousy puppeteer, he said, but you do such great sounds. He actually told me that because I was doing him in a pilot we did for CBS.

NEWMANBut they're such great sound people. He understand that the -- I'm trying to think of the -- one of my great moments recently, I did a Sesame Street two or three years ago with Elmo. And at the end of the show, Elmo hugged me and I almost teared up. It's just -- oh, golly.

NNAMDIBoth Jim Henson and the guy who does the voice for Elmo are from this area.

NEWMANThe -- oh, yeah, Kevin Clash.

NNAMDISure.

NEWMANYeah, Kevin's amazing. And he's a huge man. He's a huge man to do that little voice like, you know, Elmo, okay, you know. It's amazing. I'm trying to think what stories -- there was a lot there. The cool mom part, what I find for parents is that whenever you read a story to your kid -- and, you know, reading that story over and over, it can be very tough. Put some sounds in it and put a little bit of voice.

NEWMANYou don't have to change your voice very much. If you do the giant, just make the giant a little bit bigger like this or do a little wind. I used to always go (makes noise) it was a quiet day on the farm. A little wind. Or my mother used to read -- the only sound effect she did was a goose. And the way she did it was a (makes noise) . It wasn’t really -- but that was her -- but she would read this story about a goose.

NEWMANAnd I remember (makes noise) do the goose story, do the goose story (makes noise) . And you'd do a little bit of -- you know, just a little bit -- it doesn't take -- you don't have to be theatrical, but just that little bit will -- it makes the story come alive because it adds that energy to it.

NNAMDIAnd just watch the kids' response and you'll know how cool a mom you're being.

NEWMANThat’s exactly right. I'm trying to think anything -- one good sound effect for them. One of -- I've had some sound effect contests with people and one of my favorites that a guy -- and he was blind and he did one sound effect. He did a bicycle horn. But it was the most extraordinary -- mine is pale in comparison to his.

NEWMANThere -- there you go, a light word to describe an audio sound. But he did a thing where you could hear the rubber in it. But if you imitate instruments or -- how did -- if you imitate a horn, what you really do is decide what is it that makes it distinctive. And so with the bicycle horn, you're pushing out air (makes noise) in a high voice (makes noise) You can try this, too. (makes noise) Can do a falsetto (makes noise) .

NEWMANYeah. And then, but you want to draw air back in because you push the bulb. (makes noise) And even if it breaks...

NNAMDI(makes noise)

NEWMAN... (makes noise) or you could (makes noise) . You could probably...

NNAMDI(makes noise)

NEWMAN...yeah, you could. And you push it. Most -- a trumpet, high voice. (makes noise) Give me a ta ta ta first.

NNAMDITa ta ta.

NEWMANTa ta ta. That's right. Now, I actually put my thumb up so I pretend I'm playing a trumpet.

NNAMDIMm-hmm.

NEWMANSo ta ta ta, but it's lips that makes a trumpet. So you go ta ta ta (makes noise) Just put your lips very loosely together and go ta ta tat.

NNAMDITa ta ta.

NEWMANPut them together. (makes noise)

NNAMDI(makes noise)

NEWMANJust let -- yeah. Let it blow out your lip.

NNAMDI(makes noise) I'm no good. (laugh)

NEWMANOh, and see, there's another thing, is that people, you really -- this is a great thing to do when you're in a car, you know, when you're alone. It's a great sound. That -- I think that's why people like cars is because they have their own sound. They can sing, they can do whatever they want to in the car. The -- but when you go (makes noise), if you mess it up (makes noise) it's okay, because you're alone.

NEWMANPeople are so inhibited about their own voices and how they sing and how they sound. So do it alone a little bit.

NNAMDII'm a great shower singer and a great car dancer.

NEWMAN(laugh) Car dancer. Oh, I like that.

NNAMDIDancing in the car.

NEWMANYou know, there's one other thing about the car that -- there is a theory going. You know that if I ask people in America to hum a note, you know what they will hum?

NNAMDINo.

NEWMANThey will hum a B. A B.

NNAMDIWhy?

NEWMANNow, I'll give you a clue. In Europe, they'll hum an A Flat.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANAnd I've done this with audiences. I've done it separately with people. I've done it with audiences and you can check the note. It's very close. Can you imagine? There's a clue in there.

NNAMDINo.

NEWMANWe have a 50 -- a 60-cycle current. They have 50-cycle current. It's -- the B is a multiple of 60.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANThe close to -- to B. And we have that hum of electricity. That's the 60-cycle hum that all audio guys hate because that's the sound of AC electricity that...

NNAMDISure, yeah.

NEWMAN...of florescent light.

NNAMDIAudio guys hate it, you're right.

NEWMANAnd when I was coming along, I didn't have anything to tune my banjo that I used to play -- I still play. But Earl Scruggs said he didn't have a tuner so he would tune it to the florescent string, the B string to the florescent light. Now, when you -- that sound is around us all the time. And so much so that that's what you would hum, if you just hum. Not all the time, but that's pretty much what people hum.

NEWMANWhen you're in a car, it's not there. That's why the car -- that hum is not around you. When you get outdoors away from things -- but even then, air conditioners and other things, you can't get away from it. You have to go really out in the wilderness to get away from sound. But is a car is your own sonic capsule and you control it by your radio dial.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANSo give money right now to the (laugh) So -- but that -- so there's a relief in not hearing that 60-cycle hum that we have around us all the time, that DC current.

NNAMDITell us a little bit about what it's like to work on a "Prairie Home Companion." How do you come up with the sound effects for each show that you're on?

NEWMANYou know, that show, it -- I described it last night to some folks. It's like out of head of Zeus. I mean, Garrison -- I don't know of any show that is so much -- and I can't think of a show in history really that's so much the product of one man's imagination and it continues to be, on a weekly level, that it -- he writes, produces, sings, does the songs. He goes, no, let's try it this way.

NEWMANAnd he -- let's have a little more reggae in it, whatever. He is amazing on so many fronts. We go in on Friday and we'll see some scripts and we will get -- we'll get a read-through of those scripts. Not so much for us as the actors, Sue and Tim and I . We will get -- not so much for us, but for him to hear it because he has no editor. And he writes, I would say, 90 percent of the show. We might throw in ideas, but he writes it.

NEWMANAnd those shows, like The Elves and the Shoemaker, are done overnight. And when we come to the show, right before the show, we might get another read-through. Maybe, not always. And we will -- there will be different scripts. He will have cleaned things up or maybe thrown them out. (unintelligible) and those kind of things. Those are pretty set scripts. Things happen in it. Like I say, it's jazz.

NEWMANSo if I do a sound effect that's a little late or the door doesn't close quite hard enough, oh, you -- you seemed casual. He will change whatever.

NNAMDIYeah.

NEWMANOr I'll get choked on a dog bark or whatever, he will -- I think the dog's collar is too tight. I mean, he will actually react. So it's all sort of jazz. When he and I go out, it's very funny because we've gotten -- and Tom Keith is a better radio sound effects guy than I am, hands down. He uses -- he's an old-time radio guy, you know. He uses dowels for soldiers marching. But it's easier for me to go (makes noise) so I do -- I just do it with my mouth.

NEWMANSo it makes it more improvisational. So when Garrison might say, let's do something with office supplies. And he will go up and make -- we may have a script, maybe not, but we go -- and it's never what's on...

NNAMDII want to hear how you and Tom Keith get together because there was sort of a sound effects jewel the two of you did last month at the Minnesota State Fair. We'll play just a little bit of that.

NNAMDIThat's enough.

NEWMANThey're kind of improv. We're not sure what's coming there so yeah.

NNAMDIYou're not sure what you're going to run into at the Minnesota State Fair. I've been there, believe me.

NEWMANThat's exactly right, yeah.

NNAMDIHere is Dick in Columbia, Md. Dick, I think you have a sound effect for us.

DICKWell, we have been listening to the show with a parrot.

NNAMDIYes. (laugh)

DICKI picked him in the pet store and had you on the radio and you can hear him. But I'm going to turn on the speakerphone. If your guest would like to talk to him, he reacts enormously to the sounds. His name is Jimmy. Here he is, hold on.

NNAMDIWe're hearing Jimmy very clearly.

NEWMANHi, Jimmy (makes noise) Jimmy?

NNAMDIJimmy's going what, what?

NEWMANWhat -- what is it? What is that?

NNAMDIHey, Dick, thank you very much for your call.

NEWMANWow, that's so cool.

NNAMDIThat is...

DICKHello, this is Dick again.

NEWMANNot the parrot. Not Jimmy.

DICKIt's amazing how that bird reacts to sounds. Talk about auditory.

NEWMANYes.

NNAMDIYeah.

DICKIt was a real kick to be driving along and have you on the radio and have the bird reacting to your sound.

NEWMANDo you know why -- I've read this about parrots because they are fascinating. Why parrots imitate?

DICKMm-hmm, why is that?

NEWMANBecause they're training you to respond to them. Because you respond -- we respond and they do that because they get this great response. And they have these great ears. They're training you. It's not the other way around.

NNAMDIOh.

NEWMANSo when they go pretty boy, you go, oh, you know, hello, and so you interact with them. So they can grab attention that way.

NNAMDIHey, Dick...

DICKThat corresponds exactly with what the bird does in the pet store where he was for the weekend while we were at the beach. Everyone who comes into the pet store, he'll say, hello.

NEWMANThat's right.

DICKEverybody comes over and talks to him.

NEWMANThat's amazing.

NNAMDIHe's training us all. Dick, thank you very much for sharing that with us. Fred, have you ever thought about going back to the world of quote unquote "real jobs"? If you had to work a different job, what would it be?

NEWMANOh, golly. I would, you know, I would probably work somewhere in -- I would be -- maybe I would install cable or I would...

NNAMDIThe cable guy.

NEWMAN...or I would be -- I like wiring. I was a real nerd in the basement, you know. I had my little scientific experiments. I make things. I do -- create little instruments and if it's -- I don't know. If I didn't do sound, I'm not sure what I'd do. I love music and I play a few instruments, but...

NNAMDIIt would probably be music.

NEWMANA real job, I don't know how I could do that.

NNAMDIHe's never going to have a real job. That's what...

NEWMANI think that's -- I think that's pretty much it, yeah.

NNAMDI...it boils down to. Fred Newman...

NEWMANThey would kick me out of places.

NNAMDI...he's an award-winning writer, actor, sound designer and musician. You often hear him on a Prairie Home Companion and on the PBS children's show "Between the Lions," but he does a lot of other stuff. His book on sound effects is called, "Mouth Sounds." Thank you all for listening. I'm Kojo Nnamdi.