MR. KOJO NNAMDIFrom WAMU 88.5, at American University in Washington, welcome to "The Politics Hour." I'm Kojo Nnamdi. Tom Sherwood is off, but I'm sure he'd like me to remind you, as he did in this week's column in the Current Newspaper, that post-9/11 security is driving him bananas. He raises this question at the end of his column: Do we Americans want to live in truly safe locked-down environments?

MR. KOJO NNAMDIWell, he'll have to answer that question when he comes back next week. Our guest analyst today is Alan Suderman. He is the "Loose Lips" columnist for the Washington City Paper. Alan, good to see you again.

MR. ALAN SUDERMANThanks for having me.

NNAMDIYou have been writing about legacy politicians in Washington, D.C. Last week, you talked about the two Browns and Harry Thomas Jr. in Ward 5, and you ended the column with the words: They're all part of a larger political family. And I was intrigued by that phrase. What is the larger political family?

SUDERMANWell, that's a great question, Kojo.

SUDERMANI think there's a sense, particularly among older African-American residents in the city that -- who have seen, you know, the District come of age politically and have seen political figures produce offspring who've come of age themselves. In recent years, they view these council members as part of a larger family. And that's what I was trying to get at.

NNAMDIWell, you certainly did get added. I'm sure you got a lot of responses, but none from the council members themselves?

SUDERMANOne council member's chief of staff recently called me and said they thought it was a fair piece, so...

NNAMDII will...

SUDERMAN...that's always bad news.

NNAMDIWe'll have to see what happens with that in the future. And this week, you and a few others have been writing about the lawsuit filed by the attorney general of the city against Cornell Jones and Miracle Hands. Cornell Jones is well-known in some quarters of the city as a former drug dealer turned nonprofit coordinator, who runs Living Hands, which is supposed to provide job training for people who are living with HIV and AIDS.

NNAMDIAnd the attorney general says -- well, what does the attorney general say?

SUDERMANI believe he says that -- and forgive me if I get some of the details wrong. But the gist of it, of the lawsuit that the attorney general has filed against Mr. Jones and his nonprofit, is that instead of using 300 or so in city funding -- $300,000 in city funding to -- for job training for people with HIV-AIDS, that money went to renovate a warehouse that was then sold off and turned into a strip club.

SUDERMANSo that makes great headlines. And it's -- you know, it's one of those fun stories. AIDS money for strip clubs that no can seem to stay away from.

NNAMDIThe word strip club in a story does get people's attention.

SUDERMANIt's gold.

NNAMDIBut Mr. Jones has, in fact, in turn, filed suit against the city for...

SUDERMANYes.

NNAMDI...defamation.

SUDERMANYes. There's no better defense than a good offense, right?

NNAMDIYep.

SUDERMANSo he is suing for $2 million, saying that the city has defamed him and then discriminated against him because he's African-American. And that's the reason why he says they withheld other funding from his group.

NNAMDIMore to come, it's a story that I certainly find intriguing. And we'll be looking to pursue the story in the future. Andi Pringle, who was hired last week as part of a two-person team in D.C. Mayor Vincent C. Gray's administration, resigned this past Wednesday, after coming under fire for voting in last year's District primary while she lived in North Bethesda. And her business license in D.C. was revoked after she failed to renew it.

NNAMDIShe says that reports of the license being revoked were unfair because she was a product of these economic times. I'm a little puzzled as to the voting controversy because I think if she was registered to vote in the District of Columbia and had not officially changed her registration to Maryland, then she was entitled.

SUDERMANWell -- but the question is how long she lived in Maryland, and that she said she lived there for 18 months. You know, after 30 days, I think you're supposed to switch your registration. I'm not totally clear on the law, but, you know, there are plenty of high profile examples. We were talking about this earlier. Ralph Nader, one of the deputy chief of staffs to President Obama, who have lived in D.C. for a long time...

NNAMDIForever.

SUDERMANForever.

SUDERMANAnd vote elsewhere. So I don't think it's black and white as that she committed out-and-out vote fraud. You know, she says that she's from the District. She's lived here for 10 years. She moved. She still had the District in her heart, I guess, and thought she was entitled to vote. She did undercut her argument, though, when asked why she didn't vote in the special election earlier this year. And she said, well, I lived in Maryland.

SUDERMANI felt like I was a Maryland resident, which she'd been a Maryland resident when she voted in the primary. So it's a good question. We'll see how it shakes out. You know, the complaint has been filed against her. It's for the experts to determine now, but it cost her job.

NNAMDIShe decided she stepped aside because she didn't want to be a distraction. And when we were talking before the show, you suggested it might have been a distraction, but not necessarily for long.

SUDERMANRight. I didn't think it was something she couldn't survive. And a week from now, no one would be talking about this, is my guess, as long as something else came along to talk about. And, yeah, it seems like a heavy price to pay for what could quite well be an honest mistake.

NNAMDIA perfect example of what we don't talk about for long, Michele Rhee and Kevin Johnson. They just went ahead and got married, and virtually nobody is paying any attention to it. And for a while there, it seems as if we were -- we, in media, were obsessively concerned about this.

SUDERMANYou'll have to speak for yourself...

NNAMDII tried to lure Kaya Henderson, the new superintendent, into talking about her personal life, and she just displayed it all on the air, told me exactly what her situation -- took all of the intrigue out of it.

SUDERMANYeah, well, I'm just surprised that the mayor wasn't invited to the wedding.

NNAMDIYou were surprised.

NNAMDIWell, enough of that. Joining us in studio now is a member of the D.C. City Council. She's a Democrat from Ward 3, the chair of the council's Committee on Public Works and Transportation, herein after to be known as Calamity Jane. You've already...

NNAMDI...tweeted Alan Suderman about the new condition, if you will, of Councilmember Mary Cheh. She is wearing a sling again, second time you've come into this studio wearing a sling. Councilmember Cheh, welcome. Thank you for joining us. What the heck happened?

MS. MARY CHEHIt was a bicycle accident. And it was fantastic in that I went over the handlebars and, you know, catapulted through the air. And I broke a collarbone and cracked some ribs. And here I am.

NNAMDIWell, we're very sorry to hear about that. The last time you were wearing a sling in this studio, that was as a result of a running accident.

CHEHIt was the other side, though.

NNAMDIIt was on the left side.

CHEHI had a broken arm.

NNAMDIOn the left side.

CHEHYeah.

NNAMDIWell, I think you would be well advised to find some other form of exercise that doesn't...

CHEHWell, a friend of mine said that she's not going to let me go out anymore unless I have bubble wrap on or something.

NNAMDIWell, I hope you recover from this one very quickly. If you'd like to join the conversation with Councilmember Mary Cheh, you can call us at 800-433-8850. Or send email to kojo@wamu.org, a tweet, @kojoshow. Our guest analyst is Alan Suderman. He's the "Loose Lips" columnist for the Washington City Paper.

NNAMDIMary Cheh, you just spent months leading a special committee that investigated the Gray administration's hiring practices, a committee that released a report a few weeks ago that found the mayor's office was guilty of both cronyism and nepotism in hiring appointees.

NNAMDISince that report came out, one of the mayor's newest aides -- we just discussed that -- was forced to resign, or resigned of her own free will, within her first week on the job because of those scandals, those couple of embarrassing episodes, if you will. How had these latest events shaped your own perspective of this administration?

CHEHWell, when I heard about the deputy chief of staff, I just shook my head because it's like, you know, can't the mayor get traction finally? I had thought after the report was released and people were able to see what happened and he acknowledged that, you know, better supervision should have been exercised over the people he put in charge of some of these personnel decisions, that we should go forward.

CHEHAnd then he had a new team, a new chief of staff, new deputy, and then this happened. So I don't think it's, you know, such a big deal. I don't necessarily agree with Alan. I'm glad that the woman resigned because, you know, then it would be referred somewhere. Then they would investigate. It would dribble out, you know. It's unfortunate that she lost her job over this if there's really nothing untoward about it.

CHEHBut, you know, these jobs are not entitlements. And if there -- in the way of the mayor getting traction, I'm glad that she's resigned.

SUDERMANYeah, but good luck, you know, finding someone else to -- I mean, who...

CHEHWell, they better vet the person. I mean, I would think that an ordinary vetting would include looking at somebody's voting record and, you know, things like, are you up to date on your tax payments, you know, the usual things that you look at. And so, that, I found to be unfortunate. I imagine, however, that the next person who comes forward -- and you're saying if one does -- they're going to be looked over entirely, thoroughly, or they better be.

SUDERMANWell, I've heard they're looking internally now because they figured they have people in the mayor's office (unintelligible).

CHEHBut, yeah, don't count on that. But, no. But don't count on that because you don't know how extensively they were vetted. One of the problems that we found in this investigation is that people were being hired under this so-called accepted service, which is like a political appointment. You don't go through the competitive service. You could just be picked out and put in a position. And they were being hired for jobs where there weren't job descriptions yet.

CHEHThey were being assigned salaries, you know, without relationship to their skills. It was almost like a free-for-all at some point. So if anybody came on, I would have some skepticism about how thoroughly they've been vetted. So, no, I wouldn't take that as a surefire way to go.

NNAMDIAnd you know Washington is a major media market. You can be sure that anybody who gets a high appointment here, whether at the national level or at the local level, is going to be scrutinized very carefully by the media. And in addition to the mainstream media here in Washington, there's always Dorothy Brazile, who's the one who broke the story...

SUDERMANRight.

NNAMDI...about the voting record.

SUDERMANWell, yeah, I mean, I don't think -- I think there's a good chance, if Dorothy hadn't pulled the voting records, that none of this would have happened.

CHEHMaybe he should choose Dorothy.

NNAMDIYeah.

NNAMDIDorothy is not going to be chosen. Dorothy is not likely to be chosen by anyone because Dorothy doesn't want to work for any politician. Back in the spring, David Catania went so far as to call your initial report on Mayor Gray's hires a whitewash. Now that you've put out the full report of the committee, how would you respond to that charge?

CHEHWell, I think even David Catania was impressed with the report, and he said so at...

NNAMDIHe did.

CHEH...the hearing that we had on it. I think that initial reaction was unfortunate. It wasn't correct. And I don't know that he would regret it now, but I do think that, really, it was inappropriate under the circumstances. What I had done is I came to the committee. I told them some things. And I was asking them for their direction.

CHEHAnd I was trying to act in an opposite way of some other hearings or committees that we've had where they come and they say, well, here it is. Here's what I'm going to do. I came to discuss it. And I mean, there's no point in revisiting it. I think, to the extent people had a doubt, I would have hoped that they wouldn't have doubted me. When I have a job to do, I do it, and I do it thoroughly. And that's what the ultimate product was.

NNAMDIHow has this report affected your relationship with the mayor?

CHEHWell, you know, I never discussed it with him. When some of the issues first came out, I did text him. And I said, you know, Mayor, I just want you to know that I'm going to have to look into these things. And that was it. And he never responded, and I never followed up. And I think he came to know me well enough over the four years when we served together on the council that, you know, I'm pretty straightforward.

CHEHSo -- and if I get an investigation, or if I get something to look into, I'm going to look into it. I'm not going to, you know, sweep anything under the rug. And so, I guess, he knew what was coming his way.

SUDERMANSo no reply text message?

CHEHWell, it didn't require a reply. I simply announced him. I said something -- I don't know the exact language, but I said something, you know, Mayor, I hope you understand that I'm going to have to look into these issues.

SUDERMANWell, he could have put, like, K.

CHEHYeah, he could have put that. But he didn't put anything. And maybe -- who knows? Maybe if I were on the scene, I might have seen him groan. I don't know, but I got no response.

NNAMDIGo ahead, please, Alan.

SUDERMANWell, so, okay, great. We have this report that says...

CHEHNow, what?

SUDERMANYes, exactly, now, what? I mean, what -- one of your report -- your -- one of the bullet points in the report says that there's this gentleman, Leroy Ellis, who was hired. It was a crony hire. And now he's -- that he shouldn't have been hired. His resume was not qualified for the well-paying job he has at the Department of Employment Services, and he's still there.

SUDERMANSo, you know, what do we do about it? And DOES has shown no sign that they're going to remove him. They said -- I don't know what they told me. It was a couple weeks ago. But, basically, he's -- he may have been a crony hire, but he's still going to stay at the job.

CHEHWell, you know, you can only go so far legislatively. And we can make recommendations. And we have made recommendations. The issue for me now, though, legislatively, is what to do when we come back into session. And I will have legislation that tightens up on some of the personnel practices, which haven't been looked at in a very long time. And one of them is this excepted service, these political appointments.

CHEHThere are just way too many of them. There are about 200. And the mayor gets about 160. That seems, to me, quite excessive, though there is a place for these things, for sure. The mayor ought to be able to hire people who share his vision, share his ideology and put them in sensitive positions, in agencies to see that, you know, his views are being carried through on, but not 160. And...

SUDERMANWell, what is the right number then? I mean, is it dramatically lower? Is it 16?

CHEHWell, you know, I've been looking into that as best I can. I -- and I've talked to some people about, you know, what do -- what would directors require, for example. Would they want their chief of staff? What would the mayor require in every agency, a special assistant, something like that? But, for example, you know -- and it runs the gamut. I had a conversation with the former mayor of Miami who was term-limited out.

CHEHBut he's a very progressive and, I think, very smart guy. And I was in the midst of doing this. And I said, you know, what did you all do down there with your excepted services? We didn't have anything like that. He said, we had personal -- I had a personal staff. But, basically, everybody else was hired, you know, in the ordinary course. I said, really?

CHEHAnd in the District of Columbia, we also have this other layer of personnel that can be -- people that serve at will, the...

NNAMDISo you're suggesting that the people who serve at will be significantly reduced in number?

SUDERMANAnd that we move to Miami for ethical (word?) ?

CHEHYes. Well, we could -- no. That -- no. That...

NNAMDIWhat's next? Chicago?

CHEHNeither of these things would be correct. So I'm trying to figure out what makes sense. In other words, the way I look at it is I want to go back -- what's the underlying rationale for a system like that?

CHEHThe underlying rationale is that you are able to put people in places, you know, where they matter, that the mayor has someone handpicked with the loyalty and commitment to his agenda to make sure that these things are being implemented. There aren't that many spots that you need for that. And once you start spreading it out to 160 -- and that's just a number. I don't want to fixate on the number, though the number is important.

CHEHThe second half of this is standards for the vetting of these people and publication of who they are -- we had people who are being sent over to departments before their job descriptions had been developed, before they were vetted.

SUDERMANLike Sulaimon Brown.

CHEHYes.

NNAMDISpeaking of the aforementioned Sulaimon Brown, who claimed to be an auditor, and that did certainly not seem like a position that needed to be an at-will position appointed by the mayor...

CHEHWell, but, you know, we debunked that, too. His resume took us 15 minutes by calling former employers to establish that the resume was entirely misleading.

SUDERMANIt took longer than 15 minutes.

CHEHOkay.

SUDERMAN'Cause I called those guys, too.

CHEHOh, well, they responded to...

NNAMDIOkay, 20.

CHEHNo. No. You see, they responded to us right away.

SUDERMANYeah. Yeah. They don't talk to reporters.

CHEHSo, you know, perhaps -- no, maybe not. And so he certainly wasn't vetted in any proper way.

NNAMDIOn that front, it's my understanding that you're still trying to get records from the aforementioned Sulaimon Brown. He says he's already turned those records over to the federal authorities investigating this matter. So what's your next move? Do you have one?

CHEHWell, it's correct, legally speaking, that the court won't order someone to turn over records that they don't have. But -- and I've been thinking about this because I have to decide what to do. On one level, you know, we have quite an extensive investigation. I think we know pretty much what the facts are. This could shed light -- more light on things, however. And then, you know, I have two issues.

CHEHI want to make sure that whatever we've done is thorough, and that's the issue at hand. But there's a larger issue. I can't allow people to put one over on the council. If we want information -- you know, we tried to get him to appear. He wouldn't appear. Had to go into court and force him to appear and, you know, getting records and everything. It's been, you know, a challenge all along the way.

CHEHBut I had to persist because, again, it's the integrity of the council that's in issue when you're trying to get information. And on this point, I have some doubts about what he's saying now. My doubts are, one, is the subset of things that we're looking for exactly the same as the records that he says he's turned over? I think we've asked for more than what he may have turned over. So, for that amount, I might want those.

CHEHThe other thing is I have reason to believe, reason perhaps to know, that maybe this claim that he's turned them over to the Feds is less than a complete truth.

SUDERMANSo you're chatting with the FBI?

CHEHNo. I can't say.

NNAMDIShe said reason, perhaps, to know.

CHEHI have reason to think that this statement may not be entirely correct.

NNAMDIOkay. That's your job, Alan Suderman, to figure that out. We're going to the telephones. Would you put on your headphones, please, Alan? Because we're getting a call from Paul Craney, who is the executive director of the D.C. Republican Party. Paul, thank you for calling. You're on the air. Go ahead, please.

MR. PAUL CRANEYThanks for having me on. Councilor Cheh, this is, you know, a question for you. Last week, we brought up with the Office of Campaign Finance the council members who were using their constituent service funds to make contributions to Democrat organizations. Now, we know that you asked for a refund. But you did that because you said it was a political nature contribution. That brings me to the second part.

MR. PAUL CRANEYI mean, what do you think about your peers on the council -- there's nine of them -- who are using these constituent service funds to make political contributions? I'm not talking about helping scholarships. That's only a very small percentage is going to, what they call, scholarships. There's a lot of money getting thrown around to Democrat groups.

CHEHWell, Mr. Craney, first of all, your charges were entirely irresponsible. If you're going to go ahead and say that people are not following the law, you better do your homework. And you plainly didn't do your homework. You certainly didn't do your homework with respect to me. When I asked for that $50 back, it was because I was uncertain about it. So, you know, to be on, you know, the perfect right side of the line, I asked for the $50 back.

CHEHThe other money that you attributed to me was actually not given by me to anybody. It was my predecessor who gave that money away. And if you had done any kind of proper vetting, you would have figured that out. Moreover, I have heard from other members that they have given money to political groups. It's not the beneficiary of the money. It's the purpose to which the money is used.

CHEHIf it's used for a political purpose, then you might be talking about something. But you didn't do that either. You know, you want to go out there and be relevant and, you know, be, you know, the loyal opposition, that's great. But you ought to do your homework, and you ought to be responsible.

NNAMDIPaul Craney, your turn.

CRANEYYou know, that's a very small percentage going to what are alleged, you know, scholarships. There's $500 contributions going to ward organizations. You can't say with a straight face, yes, that's going to help 100 percent of scholarships. And you know this, Councilmember Cheh, because you're a constitutional professor. You know, a contribution to Democrat organization is a contribution to Democrat organization. You can't be a little bit pregnant.

CRANEYWhen you're pregnant, you're pregnant. When you make a donation to a political organization, it's a contribution.

CHEHIf you read the limitations in the law, which, perhaps, you know, you haven't done, it talks about the purposes to which the money is used. It doesn't say the beneficiary of the money. And, therefore, there are two things you can't do essentially. You can't spend money for political purposes, and two, you can't spend it on yourself.

CHEHUntil you establish that these were spent for political purposes or for personal benefit, then your charges are irresponsible. And you haven't -- again, I'm telling you, you have not done your homework, and it's irresponsible.

NNAMDILast turn, Paul Craney.

CRANEYWell, if you look at OCF, because I have done my homework, these ward organizations are not even reporting these contributions. There's nothing. So there is something going on there. And, you know, I know you don't like us because we're Republican and we run a candidate against you. But a contribution to a Democrat organization is a contribution to a Democrat organization.

CHEHYou can run anybody you want against me, but if you make charges -- you said you did your homework? How did you not find out that the money that you said that I gave to the Ward 3 Democrats was not money I gave at all? You -- so there's a disconnect here, Mr. Craney.

NNAMDIAnd, obviously, there's going to be some more investigation about all of this. But, Paul Craney, thank you very much for your call. You, too, can call us at 800-433-8850. We're talking with Mary Cheh. She's a member of the D.C. Council. She's a Democrat from Ward 3, chair of the council's committee on public works and transportation. Our guest analyst...

CHEHAnd the environment.

NNAMDIAnd the environment. Our guest analyst is Alan Suderman.

SUDERMANI haven't done my homework either.

NNAMDIAlan Suderman is the "Loose Lips" columnist for the Washington City Paper. You can also go to our website, kojoshow.org. Join the conversation there. Send us email to kojo@wamu.org. Speaking of taking on different jobs, you've got a different job on the council these days. Kwame Brown shook up the committee assignments earlier this summer, leaving you in charge of the council's transportation committee.

NNAMDIWhat have you done so far?

CHEHWell, you know, there's always a steep learning curve whenever you move into a new area. And I've been setting about pretty systematically trying to sort of get my arms around transportation issues, public works issues. I have tentatively decided on a couple of areas where I want to focus my attention. I have found, in the past and in some of the work that I've done, if you sort of, like, hone in on a few things, you're probably more effective than trying to do everything all at once.

CHEHAnd so one of the things I want to focus on -- and I've scheduled a roundtable already -- is the taxi industry. I'm not interested in the suggestion that was put forward by some about going to a medallion system. It's not about that, but it's about the taxi industry in general and how we can improve it. There are other issues that I want to focus on.

CHEHI've been trying to understand, as fully as I can, the business about the light rail and the -- how we can get that actually going effectively, you know, not just on H Street, but as part of a system. I've been thinking more about, you know, bicycle paths, as I sit here with my broken bones...

NNAMDIBroken bones, correct.

SUDERMANPadded bike path.

CHEHPadded path, that's a wonderful idea. And, you know, I'm trying to understand, as best as I can also, the budget. But what we need, you know, around the District -- and I -- you know, I've spoken to community groups from Ward 7, but it's around the District, we need effective, efficient transportation that makes for a system so that people from all parts of the District can travel where they need to go for work and for recreation and enjoyment.

CHEHAnd, you know, I want that to be something forward-thinking. In other words, we have to think out 30, 40 years. What do we want the District to look like? And then what should we be doing now to get us there?

SUDERMANI was interested about the taxi issue because I've covered the medallion bill. But what do you see as the big problem with the taxi industry? 'Cause I know the drivers are upset for various reasons. But as a consumer, a very occasional taxi consumer, I haven't noticed a big problem. When I want a cab, I can usually get a cab, and it takes me to where I want to go. I pay the fare.

SUDERMANIt's a pretty cut-and-dry transaction. I've never been like, oh, my gosh, this is a nightmare.

CHEHWell, what we need -- there are a variety of things, you know, to have an efficient fleet, you know, that serves guests and residents. I've been talking to people, you know, the hotel association, the hospitality association, you know, and just people in general about what we need. We need a system of enforcement so that we have taxi cabs that are clean, that provide the kind of services that you can get when you go to other cities, like credit card kinds of payments.

CHEHWe need people, obviously, who are well trained about how to get from here to there. We need to make sure that we police the system, so that people from other parts of the District can get a taxi when they need to and the taxi driver doesn't say, no, I'm not going over to that ward, et cetera. So we need to have a -- you know, a set of standards and an enforcement of those standards, so that we have taxis, you know, just take people or, you know, come here on visits and go to hotels.

CHEHThey ought to be able to get in a taxi, know that it's going to be a clean taxi. They are going to charge them the fair rate, they're going to be able to take them where they need to go and that they have credit cards, and then the taxis themselves are efficient, in the sense that they run on, you know, maybe hybrids or things of that nature, and they should be, you know, taxis that are safe.

CHEHThey should, you know, we should make sure that they're safe in terms of their mechanics. And so what I want is -- and then, of course, to be fair to the drivers, we have to have a rate system that provides a proper return. It may be necessary to separate, you know, rate review from enforcement and to look at the whole taxi commission and how, you know, we conduct this thing.

CHEHIn other words, I'm willing to take a look at this from top to bottom and see how we can have a better taxi industry.

NNAMDIWe got an email from Joseph about Wisconsin Avenue. "I'd like to hear the current status of plans for redesigning Wisconsin Avenue in the Glover Park areas." Is it Glover or Glover? Some people say...

CHEHYou know, actually Glover, but potato, potato, whatever.

NNAMDI"I live through a very problematic streetscape rebuild along 14th Street Northwest in Columbia Heights, and it seems like there's an even more outrageous reworking plan for Wisconsin Avenue. Can the council member please give us a status report, describe what's likely to happen, and why it's being done?"

CHEHWell, that was something that should have been more efficiently and more quickly attended to, but the idea was, since Wisconsin Avenue down at that end, basically provides mass transportation via bus, the idea was to make the streetscape more attractive, to move off the newspaper racks. And so there -- some of the other obstructions to make it a broader path for people to walk on, make it a more convenient place for people to stand and wait for the bus.

CHEHAnd to make it basically more attractive, you know, for the businesses there. There have been some glitches, and I'm trying to work with the Department of Transportation, to see whether we can, you know, get that back on track.

NNAMDIBack to the telephones. Here is Moez (sp?) in Hyattsville, Md. Moez, you're on the air. Go ahead please.

MOEZYeah, if I may, I want to go back to the subject you talked about a moment ago, about how we put people in position of power because they contribute money for our campaign. And this is really is not just in the local, I mean -- what I have to say, state is happening. It's happening even in the Federal government. And we need to find the system how to stop this.

MOEZI mean, that's really like a third world country politics here will work people because they gave us money and we put them in position when they cannot help their people.

NNAMDIActually, Moez, I don't remember talking about that during the course of this local broadcast. But, Mary Cheh's going to make a relationship....

CHEHNo. There is a relationship there. And it's the idea, you know, that -- you know, isn't this like sort of low-level corruption when you simply, you know, fill positions with people who are your friends, your donors or things of that nature? I think that that's what the point is. And, you know, it used to be that that was the sort of order of the day. I think President Jackson was like the champion of this sort of thing.

CHEHAnd then, you know, through the years, people started saying, you know, this is a kind of a corrupt system. We ought to have a merit system. We ought to have personnel practices. We ought to have civil service. And we moved in that direction. I think that was very salutary. People shouldn't get fired just because they're, you know, with, you know, a different candidate or this, that, or the other thing.

CHEHAnd so we largely have moved to that, but there's always been a slice of it that has been left outside of it.

NNAMDIAnd the slice, in your view, is too large?

CHEHIt's too large, and I'm not saying -- we also have this sort of managerial service, that you're hired in a competitive way. But you can be fired. And their salary is commensurate with the idea that they're also at risk. But those managers, you don't want people ensconced or, you know, just kind of permanently affixed in positions if they're managers -- and you might want to change, you know, the direction of an agency. You got to have that flexibility.

CHEHBut that doesn't mean that they come in as cronies or, you know, buddies or this or that. They come in qualified, but you have to be able to say, I'm sorry, it's not working out. You're not -- you know, you're not following the game plan. We got a new coach here. You're not following the game plan. So there's that slice of it.

CHEHBut then there's this other slice that I've been talking about, the excepted service, which is a political hire, not competitive and a political fire. So we have to -- I agree with the caller. I think we have to fix that up.

NNAMDIAnd you will be introducing legislation on this issue?

CHEHYes, I will.

NNAMDIOn another issue, you have started pounding the pavement about getting a new middle school for Ward 3. What's the case you're going to make for that to happen as this process moves forward?

CHEHWell, you know, I want -- I wanted to put that out there, and I wanted to start this conversation. We have to confront in Ward 3 and some other wards -- and it's very -- different effects around the District. But in Ward 3, we have to confront our success in bringing people back into the public school system. It's an issue about capacity. And what we need -- we have one middle school, Alice Deal Middle School located in the District.

CHEHThere's another one, the Hardy Middle School, which is actually not in the ward, but serves some ward students. But what we have is our schools are already over capacity. They're already over capacity. For example, I have some figures here about Alice Deal. Alice Deal enrollment is about 1,040 students. It's larger than every other school in the entire DCPS system, except Wilson High School, also in my ward.

CHEHThe capacity is 980. It already is 1,040. The sixth grade class at Alice Deal right now without any out of boundary kids is 400. As that works its way through, you're going to have Alice Deal at 1,200. It's going to be far overcrowded. You have Hardy, which is slightly under enrolled, but it could never handle the capacity of this bubble that's coming up.

CHEHAnd I don't want to displace the kids that are in Hardy. We need a new school. We need an additional school.

SUDERMANBut -- well, that's going to be a tough sell, to say that Ward 3 needs a new middle school when in Ward 5, they don't have any middle schools.

CHEHWell, you know, one of the things -- I just spoke...

NNAMDII thought you would say, I don't represent Ward 5.

CHEHNo, no, no. But I just -- no, I'm interested in...

SUDERMANNot my problem.

CHEHNo, it should -- no, it should be a system. I entirely agree, and the system should be excellent throughout. I just spoke to the deputy mayor for education about this. They are conducting a study to look at district-wide, okay? It may also be a boundary, a line drawing issue.

CHEHFor example, at Wilson High School, we have students from eight miles away, well beyond Ward 3, that come to Wilson High School, when there is a far closer to them, a recently modernized new high school.

SUDERMANAnd when you say eight miles away, you mean in Maryland?

NNAMDINo, in the District of Columbia.

SUDERMANJust kidding.

CHEHThere are those students as well. We have to figure this out because we don't want our success in drawing people back into the public system to be defeated by the fact that we were under -- we don't have the capacity.

NNAMDIWell, we'll have to see how this one plays out because, for the time being, we are out of time. Mary Cheh, thank you so much for joining us.

CHEHWell, thank you for having me. I always enjoy it.

NNAMDIMary Cheh is a member of the D.C. Council. She's a Democrat, represents Ward 3, chairs the council's committee on public works and transportation and the environment.

CHEHCan I say, Kojo, I often see you in Rock Creek Park, and you manage to stay upright. And I congratulate you.

NNAMDIYes, 'cause I travel at a much slower speed than you do, either walking or jogging or riding. So I'll say this to you, walk safely, Mary Cheh.

CHEHThank you.

NNAMDIJoining us in studio now is David Alpert. He is the founder and editor-in-chief of the website and online community, Greater Greater Washington. David, good to see you again.

MR. DAVID ALPERTThanks so much for having me.

NNAMDIDavid, we've got to know you on this broadcast as a lot of things: a blogger, a public advocate for smart growth, a ring leader of sorts for a growing online community. But we've also noticed, over time, that your community has gotten more directly involved in raw politics. You endorse candidates. Politicians write entries on your website themselves.

NNAMDIYou hold a seat on the Metro Riders' Advisory Council. You've even spoken publicly about running candidates in various parts of the Washington area. How would you characterize the potential political influence of the community that you have helped to create? And what's your vision for it moving forward from here?

ALPERTOn Greater Greater Washington, we've been fortunate to have a really energized community of people who care a lot about creating better, walkable communities, better transit service, better parks, better neighborhoods with good retail and things like that. And a lot of the decisions that elected officials are making have a huge amount to do with that.

ALPERTSo, really, I think we can't ignore these issues and when some elected officials are doing a great job, to support them, and when some are doing a bad job, as, unfortunately, often -- sometimes is the case, to try to encourage people who might be interested in challenging them. And I think that we'd like to see some of that in some of the races that are coming up.

SUDERMANYou know, besides the political advocacy, one thing that I really do not enjoy is how you have been holding journalists accountable for doing bad work.

SUDERMANMy first introduction to Greater Greater Washington was I was working at the Examiner. My boss had a story he wanted done, and it was a transportation story. It was not my beat. So I called AAA, got their quote, wrote a story and hoped no one read it. And then it wound up on, like, the 10 -- top 10 worst transportation stories of the year.

SUDERMANSo -- but I actually think that's good because, you know...

NNAMDIYeah, scrutinize public officials. Don't scrutinize the media. If you'd like to join this conversation with David Alpert, you can call us at 800-433-8850. Go to our website, kojoshow.org. Send us a tweet, @kojoshow, or email to kojo@wamu.org. Alan, I thought you were going to pursue it because...

SUDERMANOh, no, no. I just said it is kind of remarkable, the growth that Greater Greater Washington has had both, you know, in having political -- politicians accountable and holding journalists accountable, so it's interesting to see where it goes. And it is very interesting that you are out there publicly, along with people who are not so publicly, looking for candidates to fill, and I wonder if you could give us an update on a couple races.

SUDERMANYou know, have you found anyone in Ward 7? Have you found anyone in Ward 2? You know, what should we expect? 'Cause the primary is seven months away, so...

ALPERTAt the moment, we're still really just interested in hearing from the people that are planning to run for office. I know in some wards there are a number of people, in some wards there aren't, and really getting to know them. One thing I really want to see is not just for me to personally make a decision because it's not about me.

ALPERTIt's really about the whole community that we have, and so to give the candidates and the incumbents a chance to talk to all of our readers and all of our commenters about their ideas and what they would do and kind of get a discussion going. With the last races, for example, we had a team of different contributors, people who write regularly for the site, who discussed the endorsements, including ANC races, which is one that's very important as well.

ALPERTWe tried to look at as many of the ANC, Advisory Neighborhood Commission races in D.C. as we could and come up with some recommendations about that because, while those are advisory, the folks in those offices, in those seats, do have a significant amount of influence over the shape of their neighborhoods.

NNAMDITo what degree do you look at the community that you have helped to create as a political constituency, whether we're talking about people who vote in D.C. races, Northern Virginia or in Maryland?

ALPERTIt's really, I think, just hard to separate, you know, issues from politics. Obviously with the tax laws, you know, a lot of the nonprofit organizations have to do that. They can only advocate for certain bills, you know, but not really get into the politics. But that's something of an artificial distinction. And for people who are reading a blog, who are commenting, who are participating on Twitter, it's -- you know, they're very intertwined.

ALPERTSo people who care about making our neighborhoods better are inevitably going to be paying attention to which elected officials are making their making neighborhoods better and which are not.

NNAMDIYou endorsed Vincent Gray over Adrian Fenty in the last primary in the District of Columbia last year. A couple of questions about that. Let me start with the current question first. How has Mayor Gray lived up to your expectations?

ALPERTThere are, I think, a number of areas that have met expectations, and there are definitely areas that have not. I, like most people, was very troubled and disappointed by a lot of the hiring issues that have come up. I think everyone in the city pretty much agrees upon that. But, you know, that -- the real question for me is what is going to happen with policy because, ultimately, that is the goal.

ALPERTIt's to get -- you know, getting the right people into different jobs is important insofar as they accomplish things. I think that, with transportation, for example, things have slowed down somewhat. I'd like to see things move faster. But there are a lot of really good people at the Department of Transportation. I talked to DDOT Director Terry Bellamy, and he has a lot of great ideas.

ALPERTYou know, he really knows what to do. It's not going to be turning things back to a previous era at all. Mayor Gray has expressed a strong support for continuing the street car program, for example. And so, you know, I think that we -- unfortunately, these other issues have slowed down progress because they have maybe been a distraction for the administration.

ALPERTAnd, you know, rightfully so, you know, that they've been a problem that they needed to spend a lot of effort looking at. But I'm looking forward to the time when maybe we will be able to get to the next phase where they can start really taking action.

SUDERMANI'm curious. What's your current level of access with the Gray administration? I know that, after Mayor Gray won, he invited you to be on his transportation transition team. You were on it for a bit. And then there were some questions about -- and you removed yourself from it. But, I mean, are you still -- are you talking to the mayor? Are you talking to his aides? Are you talking to people at the Department of Transportation?

ALPERTYes. And -- so, you know, just for those who don't know the transition, I wanted to participate in terms of giving ideas. They ended up structuring in a way that required people to sign non-disclosure agreements about the information they were receiving, which wasn't necessarily unreasonable. But I just felt like it wasn't compatible with sort of the journalistic role.

ALPERTYou know, sometimes I wear two hats, being a journalist sometimes and being an activist or being someone who advises people as well. So sometimes it's...

SUDERMANYou and Dorothy Brazile.

ALPERT...a matter -- exactly. So, you know, a matter of figuring out how to balance those appropriately, but...

SUDERMANWell -- so, who are you still talking to in -- or who are you talking to in the Gray administration?

ALPERTSure. I mean, you know, there are a number of people. I mean, I actually am going to be meeting with the mayor in a couple of weeks about issues concerning parks and the National Park Service.

SUDERMANAnd is this, like, a one-on-one meeting or -- how does that work?

ALPERTI reached out and said I -- we would like to talk. There -- another thing I've been working on is there are a number of groups and people from all across the city who have been very frustrated with the way the National Park Service treats a lot of the small neighborhood parks in a way that doesn't really consider their value to the neighborhood or the ways that they can serve the local neighborhood.

ALPERTThere's a lot of resistance to putting playgrounds in parks. There's -- in Rock Creek, for example, which we were just talking about before, there were a lot of walking and hiking trails that have been allowed to decay. So people in neighborhoods nearby can't really use Rock Creek. It's become more of a freeway and less of a usable park by residents. And so we want to -- we've been working with the park service.

ALPERTAnd I've been writing about it a number of times on the blog, about pushing them to work more closely with residents. And given that there's some new leadership at the National Park Service, I'm very hopeful that that will happen. So on that front, a number of people from some of the organizations and I are going to talk to the mayor in some more detail about this.

SUDERMANSo you still have his ear? Is that…

NNAMDIDo you still have his ear?

ALPERTI mean, when I'm trying to reach out to people in the Gray administration, I have found them to be receptive.

SUDERMANAnd do you text message him like Councilmember Cheh?

ALPERTI do not do that.

SUDERMANOkay.

ALPERTI don't really text message that much. I think I just -- people -- I don't know. Maybe I'm just not quite the right age group. Actually, just a little bit older than the real texting bubble, or maybe I just never caught on to texting.

NNAMDIThere's a perception among some that the issues that your site focuses on are, for the most part, issues that matter to white people or the gentrifying class, that the smart growth streetcar, bike lane set is a rival force to the traditional levers of power in the District. Two questions about that.

NNAMDIPeople would have figured -- I'm going back a year -- that you would have been a natural for endorsing Adrian Fenty because those are the issues with which he is associated. Why did you endorse Gray over Fenty last year?

ALPERTFor me, largely, it was a matter of there being a lot more issues beyond just that. I'm not a one-issue or two-issue person. It's not just about what makes there be more bike lanes. And for that matter, Mayor Gray, or then-candidate Gray, was pretty clear in his support for bike lanes. A lot of people assumed that he would be -- you know, want to tear them all out. And I talked to him, and it was very clear that that wasn't the case.

ALPERTAnd he's continued to support his Department of Transportation building bike facilities. So -- but, you know, on the broader question that you're raising…

NNAMDIYeah, the other side of that perception coin, if you will, relates to what you just said about those are not the only issues you're being -- that you're interested in because there's perception that the group of people who are interested in smart growth and environmental issues are not interested in alleviating poverty or not interested in schools or not interested in jobs in the District of Columbia.

ALPERTRight. And at least for myself, obviously, I don't know what's in the mind of every person in the District. But for myself, I think these things are very important. And I'm supportive of having these things, like bike lanes, because I think they are one of many components of the kind of city that we want to have, where every -- you know, it's not choked by traffic and pollution that reduce people's health, and people can get to work easily.

ALPERTAnd we spend less money on our transportation so that we, you know, have a stronger budget, more robust budget. But affordable housing is extremely important to that sort of a vision. Having healthy neighborhoods with lower crime in all parts of the District, and all parts of the region, for that matter, are an important part of that. We've had a number of articles lately about jobs.

ALPERTIn fact, yesterday, we just had one about the high unemployment in Ward 8, in particular, and how, you know, there really could be more attention paid to that, I think, by urbanists and then just by all elected leaders and the press as well.

SUDERMANPart of that sounded like a stump speech.

NNAMDIUh-oh.

ALPERTNo.

NNAMDIHave you considered offering yourself for office as a candidate in the District of Columbia?

ALPERTI think being able to work with people through the blog is, for me, the best opportunity to be a part of the conversation and help people. I'd like to help really good candidates be elected to office. I think that's, for me, the best way to participate.

SUDERMANSo you'd rather be the puppet master than the puppet itself, is what you're saying.

ALPERTYeah, I mean, I -- well, what -- the stuff that I write, when I talk about things, I am very public about it. What I'm saying is visible to everyone. So where that's not puppetry is, you know, the hand is very visible. I'm standing there next to them. I may be the other person, like in "Sesame Street," you know, the person standing on the street talking to the puppet, as opposed to the actual puppeteer.

SUDERMANThe random character who talks to Oscars.

ALPERTExactly.

SUDERMANOkay.

NNAMDIWhat are some of the regional issues that you're most focused on going into the fall, whether we're talking about Metro -- which I want to get back to --county government, D.C. government, Congress?

ALPERTThere are a number of them. I think our region is really engaged in a debate right now, which, to some extent, they have been in many times, about regional growth and where do we invest, things like our transportation dollars. In Virginia, the -- Gov. McDonnell has made a fairly clear statement, and Secretary -- Transportation Secretary Sean Connaughton, that they're not very into Metro. They're not very into transit.

ALPERTConnaughton said he didn't want to spend much money on the Silver Line project at all. But they're borrowing huge amounts from, essentially, our -- my grandchildren, even, you know, if not my children, to pay for a lot of freeway growth, which, you know, sounds good, in a way.

ALPERTBut the experience we've had over 50 years with building roads, especially in outer suburban areas, is simply that you build a road or widen one, and more people end up moving to the other end of that road because they can now drive in that direction to get to work. And then the road fills up, and then you're essentially back where you started, even with worse traffic. So I think that that's a mistake, and that's been a big debate in the region.

NNAMDIAnything about Congress, any focus on Congress at all?

ALPERTCongress, there's -- I'm definitely following the transportation -- again, with transportation reauthorization bill they're actually working on right now, there's really a big fight going on about whether funding for bicycle and pedestrian programs is going to be cut entirely. Eric Cantor, the Virginia representative -- I forget if he's majority leader or majority whip.

ALPERTBut he's been really, unfortunately, flogging bicycle and pedestrian facilities, kind of making a scapegoat out of them. And I think that's very sad, especially given that, in his district, there's going to be a bike share system in Richmond, for example. And, you know, people are getting a lot of benefit from these programs, not to mention that a lot of people simply walk in all parts of the region.

SUDERMANI noticed you drove up in a pickup truck with the extra big wheels. How does that gel with your...

ALPERTIt was three Lincoln Navigators, actually. I had two other people...

SUDERMANBodyguards?

ALPERTExactly.

NNAMDIHe did drive up in a pickup truck?

SUDERMANNo.

ALPERTNo.

SUDERMANI just made that up. I'm sorry.

NNAMDIOh. You hold a seat on the Metro Riders' -- you had me going there. You hold a seat on the Metro Riders' Advisory Council, which, in the view of some, might make you a part of Metro's establishment. But what is your view about how Metro is operating these days?

ALPERTI think there are -- Metro is on the right track, in a lot of ways, but there's still a long way to go. I'm very heartened by the greater communication that we've started to see from the new social media and press folks for a number of years. Unfortunately, Metro's attitude -- you know, I don't know if it was from the top or from people, you know, at a lower level.

ALPERTSo, you know, it's not about blaming anyone, but the attitude seemed to be we'll kind of say as a little less possible. Now, there's a lot more engagement, and that's great. They're being -- they also have the adequate funding, really, and a management more focused on making some of the safety repairs that are necessary -- escalators, fixing the track systems.

ALPERTIt's -- one of the things that's most important -- again, you were mentioning Congress before -- is Congress has been appropriating money for Metro each year for the last two now. They've promised to do it for 10 years. Last year, the Republicans tried to cut that. Fortunately, it was just revealed that in their budget this year, at least, they're not trying to cut that particular thing. There's a lot more that's being cut, but not that one.

ALPERTBut we have a long way to go. And, really, Metro was so underfunded in terms of repair for so many years that it's just going to take a while to get things working.

NNAMDIAfraid we're just about out of time. David Alpert, thank you so much for joining us.

ALPERTThank you so much.

NNAMDIDavid is the founder and editor-in-chief of the website and online community Greater Greater Washington. Alan Suderman, the weather has apparently forced the organization -- the organizers of the nation's triathlon to cancel the swim leg of the Sunday's event. We know Kwame Brown will be participating in it. Do you know if former Mayor Fenty is also involved?

SUDERMANI do not. But I wouldn't be surprised if he showed up.

NNAMDIYou're covering it? You're planning to be there?

SUDERMANOh, I'm going to win that race.

NNAMDIAlan Suderman is our guest analyst today. And he's starting out to be a hell of a liar. He's the "Loose Lips" columnist for Washington City Paper. Thank you all for listening. I'm Kojo Nnamdi.