MR. KOJO NNAMDIFrom WAMU 88.5, at American University in Washington, welcome to "The Politics Hour," starring Tom Sherwood. I'm Kojo Nnamdi. Tom Sherwood is our resident analyst. He's an NBC 4 reporter and a columnist for the Current Newspapers, which did not say in this week's edition Tom Sherwood is away on vacation.

MR. TOM SHERWOODIt was a test to see if anybody would notice, and thank you for noticing.

NNAMDIYes. I noticed that. And so the Current Newspapers in the future if Tom Sherwood is going to be on vacation, please, let us know that he will be coming back.

SHERWOODI think if they write my name, they have to pay me. So maybe they didn't put my name there.

NNAMDISo, anyway, you will be coming back. Later in this broadcast, we'll be talking with Barbara Favola. She's a Democratic candidate for the Virginia Senate. She is running for the seat in the Commonwealth's 31st District, being vacated by outgoing Sen. Mary Margaret Whipple. We'll also be talking with the majority leader of the Maryland House of Delegates, Kumar Barve. He's a Democrat from Montgomery County.

NNAMDIBut first, Tom Sherwood, just about anywhere in the world, if the champion Barcelona FC is rumored to be having a kick-around, a practice that's -- it's free, you'd have to bring riot police along to restrain the crowd. So that team happens to be in town to play Manchester United in a repeat of the Champions League final that they played in.

NNAMDIAnd the team decided to have a little kick-around on the ellipse, a little pick-up soccer where a lot of people do that on weekdays and weekends. I don't know if it was the bus or maybe it was the number of players there, but, pretty soon, a park police officer wanted to know who's in charge here. And just like that, Barcelona FC was back on the bus, out of town. Can't do that here. Can't...

SHERWOODWell, it's a good thing they didn't try to dance at the Thomas Jefferson Memorial. They really would -- they would have been arrested and wrestled to the ground. I mean, we can't have people enjoying the National Mall. The grass is dying.

NNAMDIWhat's up with that? The most celebrated...

SHERWOODThe heat got to somebody.

NNAMDI...soccer team in the entire country is going to have a free practice here.

SHERWOODDid somebody not -- now, on -- I don't want to be too hard on the park police, but, you know, did someone maybe from the organization kind of call the park police and say we're going to stop by and make it kind of an event? Did they make any plan?

NNAMDIMaybe not. Maybe that was what they did not do.

SHERWOODAnd if they just show up, and suddenly there's too much commotion...

NNAMDIThere's a big bus and too many players. This is not...

SHERWOODI know.

NNAMDI...the usual pick-up game, so...

SHERWOODAnd it had that weird game called football in the rest of the country.

NNAMDIThis was national news in Spain, okay?

SHERWOODYeah, well, right.

NNAMDIThat this happened here. That is a big deal.

SHERWOODWell, you know, we're trying to keep heavy-duty stuff off the mall. The bus didn't drive onto the grass, did it? Maybe that's...

NNAMDII don't know if the bus drove onto the grass and...

SHERWOODI'm just glad they didn't try to dance at the Jefferson Memorial because we will all -- would have been offended.

NNAMDII know you'll want to talk about this, so let me get it out of the way. Albert Haynesworth, Donovan McNabb...

SHERWOODAlbert Haynesworthless.

NNAMDI...out of town.

SHERWOODHis name is Albert Haynesworthless.

NNAMDIHaynesworthless. Not Fat Albert Haynesworth.

SHERWOODWell, I don't want to say anything about his weight. He can, you know, Albert Haynesworth...

NNAMDIAre you happy that he's leaving?

SHERWOODHe has -- has he actually left town yet?

NNAMDII have no idea. I'm not following that.

SHERWOODYou know, he might have a -- he might throw a hissy fit against the transportation people and not go.

NNAMDIHe's going to the New England Patriots.

SHERWOODI wish -- I hope that he will be very successful there, and I hope he will see this as a chance to redeem his image and work hard to be a star player.

NNAMDIYeah, well...

SHERWOODSo he could thumb his nose back at us here. But he was a disaster here.

NNAMDII'm not hoping for any of those things because the reputation, as we have here, our history is that he's going to suddenly redevelop there and come back here and crush us whenever we play them. So I don't want that.

SHERWOODWell, he...

NNAMDIDonavan McNabb going to the Minnesota Vikings.

SHERWOODI know. You know...

NNAMDIGood for him.

SHERWOOD...the Redskins, you know, I got to rev up my support for them this year. But, you know, that was a disaster on both sides. And it's unfortunate that he had to come here. I hope he doesn't go to Minnesota to have other problems still. I like the way he plays. He's kind of the Fred Couples of football. Fred Couples is the most lackadaisical kind of golfer, but he's really good. And McNabb is the same way. He just didn't fit with the cow people.

NNAMDIThe Washington Kastles ran the table...

SHERWOODWho? Who?

NNAMDIThe Washington Kastles.

SHERWOODWho?

NNAMDIThe local professional tennis franchise.

SHERWOODThe only winning team in town.

NNAMDIWon -- ran the table, won all of the regular season games and won the final. First time that's ever been done in World Team Tennis history.

SHERWOODWhat's that, 36 years or something?

NNAMDIHarriet Tregoning, the director of the Office of Planning, who rides to work on her bicycle, got hit by a car that...

SHERWOODTrain.

NNAMDI...was running a red light. What does that say to you about who knows the regulations and who does not in this town?

SHERWOODWell, it was -- you know, first of all, Harriet Tregoning was not injured, but she was bruised up a little bit. And what's the name of that bike? She has one of those fold-up, foldaway bikes.

NNAMDIA Brompton.

SHERWOODYou put it in your pocket when you get to your office, and you unfold -- I saw her -- well, I was at Gallaudet University one day, and she had ridden...

NNAMDIIt's a Brompton.

SHERWOODAnd I'm glad she's okay. But it's just -- it reinforces the idea that bike riding is a dangerous thing in the city, and that's why the city is aggressively trying to put in bike lanes.

NNAMDIYou want...

SHERWOODAnd people should wear helmets.

NNAMDIYou want to put out your bike riding schedule for our drivers out there, so they can be aware of when you're on the streets. So they can either, A, avoid or, B, deliberately hit you.

SHERWOODWell, let me just say this. When I ride, I'll be probably riding this afternoon. I keep one hand free in case I need to give a wave to anyone.

NNAMDIOr a punch...

NNAMDI...the case might be.

SHERWOODNo, I'm nonviolent.

NNAMDIAnd finally, there's this. Of course, Councilmember Harry Thomas Jr. has agreed to pay $300,000 to the city. When we had a kind of Your Turn this week, we couldn't find anybody on the phone who thought he should stay in his job. But, apparently, that is what he's planning on doing. He has admitted no wrongdoing. The city's attorney general says, hey, that's as far as I can go.

NNAMDIThe U.S. attorney, of course, is still investigating whether there was any -- whether they should bring any criminal charges. What do you say?

SHERWOODWell, Ward 7 Councilmember Yvette Alexander, who's not a firebrand, said, I wouldn't pay back $300,000 if I didn't take it. And so here he's agreed to pay back $300,000. I might add the city taxpayers have given him an interest-free loan for the last couple of years, so he's not denying he took the money. He's just saying there's some accounting mistakes. And so he's paying back at an interest-free loan.

SHERWOODI mean, it's just the end of the civil part of this. And some of his supporters say, well, you know, wait till the final word is in. Wait till the U.S. attorney finds any criminal wrongdoing. In other words, he's innocent until proven guilty. Well, in the court of public opinion, he's not innocent until proven guilty. He's agreed to pay back $300,000 he should have not taken.

NNAMDITwo and...

SHERWOODThat's guilty. Councilmember Catania and Mary Cheh have urged him to resign.

NNAMDITwo and a half members of the council have asked him to resign, Catania and Mary Cheh and Tommy Wells. Tommy is only a half member.

SHERWOODHalf member because he was, you know, gutted by the council chairman. But, you know, and so Mr. Wells -- I mean, Tom -- Mr. Thomas has never denied -- he's never explained where the money went. The one thing we do know about that money, it didn't go to the children's sports programs where it was intended to go. So somebody got the money, and the only person so far as appears to have it is Tommy Thomas. It's a very sad thing.

SHERWOODI like him a lot as an individual. But the outrage factor of him taking money intended for children in this city is just beyond the pale.

NNAMDIHe's a likable guy, but we couldn't find anybody who called in...

SHERWOODAnd we'll see. There might be a move to -- you know, he's got this 250 -- he's got this defense fund now that he's putting up by his lawyers.

NNAMDIThis is true.

SHERWOODAnd there's no law requiring any disclosure of who gives money to that organization. So there's some move -- maybe the council members. There might be an emergency bill when they come back in September requiring that these things be disclosed, so the public will know who's paying the $300,000 because most people think Tommy Thomas doesn't have it.

NNAMDIThis is shaping up to be a political year in Maryland that will be remembered more for legislative failures maybe than successes. But Gov. O'Malley last week threw his weight behind one of the efforts that came up short in Annapolis earlier this year, same-sex marriage. Joining us in studio was the chief sponsor -- is the chief sponsor of that same-sex marriage bill. He's Kumar Barve, majority leader of the Maryland House of Delegates.

NNAMDIHe's a Democrat from Montgomery County. Kumar Barve, thank you so much for joining us.

MR. KUMAR BARVEGreat to be here.

NNAMDIMr. Majority Leader, as I mentioned, you were the chief sponsor of that same-sex marriage bill that died in the state House. What do you see as the way forward on that issue? And where does the governor now fit into it?

BARVEWell, first of all, it's great to be here. And let me say that the bill passed in the Senate. The majority leader in the Senate was the sponsor on that side. It came up two votes short in the House of Delegates. You know, I think everybody in Annapolis acknowledges the fact that with the full support of a governor, you can get an additional three or four votes, and I feel confident that that's what's going to happen.

BARVEA couple of things. A, the governor is completely behind it, and I'm very happy that he's taken over the prime sponsorship of the legislation. But also, I think in society, generally, opinions are changing with respect to marriage equality or same-sex marriage. I think that a public that, as recently as five years ago, was very skeptical about the concept, it's now much, much more supportive.

BARVEAnd I'm confident that we'll have the votes in the House and the Senate next year, and it will, in fact, get signed by the governor.

SHERWOODA number of people, commentators have said that Maryland, firstly -- he was -- the governor was firstly embarrassed into taking a stronger stand because he saw what Andrew Cuomo did in New York and who marshaled lobbying efforts, spent months working on it. What will Gov. O'Malley do other than saying he's for it? How does he build the support that you're expecting to build?

BARVEWell...

SHERWOODWhat does he do?

BARVEWell, first of all, let's -- let me just say this about people and their support for marriage equality. I think virtually every straight person in America has gone on a little bit of a journey on this. I think all of us have been considering this in our minds for a great number of years. I came to decide of supporting this four or five years ago. Our speaker actually came to it relatively recently -- Mike Bush -- and he understands the issues.

BARVEAnd he's very supportive of it as well. And I think Gov. O'Malley was one of the many people who's made that transition of accepting this as a good civil rights measure. Now, the governor -- you know, the governor of the state of Maryland is the most respected Democrat in the state of Maryland. He's certainly the most powerful Democrat in the state of Maryland, most powerful individual.

BARVEAnd you would be amazed at how persuasive when the top guy, in this case, it's a guy -- how persuasive the top guy can be. And one thing I will say that -- we didn't have a recorded vote in the House of Delegates last year. We put the bill back in committee, and there are -- I would say that there are four or five members of the House who are genuinely undecided, who were, at that point, were genuinely undecided on the issue.

SHERWOODWell, how many were in Prince George's County? Two -- there were two in Prince George's County at least?

BARVEYou know what? I...

SHERWOODOkay.

BARVE...I would rather not go into details such as those. But there were at least five and maybe six who were genuinely undecided, and I think...

NNAMDIWell, a lot of those five or six or, I think, a majority of those five or six were from socially conservative districts. Some of them, African-American...

BARVEMm hmm.

SHERWOODThat's why I mentioned Prince George's County.

BARVEBut not all. I mean...

NNAMDIThat's true.

BARVEI mean, for example, we -- here's something that you would not ordinarily anticipate. I have many friends who are anti-abortion. They're pro-life on the abortion issue, and yet they support marriage equality. This is an issue that cuts in ways that are a little unexpected. I mean, there are -- it's a complex and different issue from the typical social issues that we have.

NNAMDIWhat I was getting to is, what conversations have you had with those members of your party, the ones who pulled their support about this issue since the session wrapped up?

BARVEWhich ones? Are you talking about people undecided?

NNAMDIThe people who seem to be undecided but who, at the last minute when you were expecting their support, pulled their support.

BARVEWell, I mean, a couple of them -- one in particular felt that we should broaden the protections for religious organizations. Another one decided that she just wasn't there emotionally yet. And this is -- as I said, it's an emotional issue that people have to really process for a great deal of time. And, you know, this is really the first time the bill was really seriously considered in the Maryland General Assembly.

BARVEAnd I think introducing a bill in January and having it debated in February and March is probably not enough time for a lot of people to really go through it. Now, as a result of what happened last year, I think every person, not just the people who are undecided, every person has been giving a lot of time and thought and emotional soul searching to this issue.

BARVEAnd, I think, by the time we get to our general assembly session in January, I think people will pretty much know where they are.

NNAMDIIf you'd like to join the conversation with Kumar Barve -- he is majority leader of the Maryland House of Delegates -- call us at 800-433-8850. Send email to kojo@wamu.org, a tweet, @kojoshow, or go to our website, kojoshow.org. Join the conversation there. Gov. O'Malley doesn't always have the Midas touch when it comes to pushing his priorities in the General Assembly.

NNAMDIHis push to get rid of the death penalty came up short a few years ago. This year, he pushed an offshore wind energy plan that ultimately fizzled. And then he went on to say that the assembly choked on a few big issues this year. How would you measure the political capital the governor has in Annapolis right now? And how would you respond to the claim that you and your colleagues choked this year, particularly on offshore wind power?

BARVEOkay. Well, let's take offshore wind as an example.

NNAMDIYeah.

BARVEI believe that we are going to craft legislation that's going to bring offshore wind online. But it is not a simple -- unlike issues -- unlike social issues, money is involved here. And the estimates as to what the cost would be for society and for individual ratepayers were not anywhere close to the level of precision that we -- that a legislator would need in order to make this decision.

BARVEYou know, let me draw an analogy with the Greenhouse Gas Reduction Act of 2009. I was a prime sponsor of that as well. But that was a piece of legislation that we literally worked on for three years. It was introduced. It didn't go anywhere. A commission was formed that I served on. And then the governor really got behind it. And then the third year of this effort, it passed. And it's one of the strictest laws of its kind in the United States.

BARVEI guess what I'm trying to say here is that when you try to do difficult things, it sometimes takes one, two or three years. And, you know, going all the way back to the '90s when we did health care reform, it took us two years to do it. It wasn't an overnight thing.

NNAMDITom in Takoma Park, Md., does that answer the question you had on this issue?

TOMYes, sure. Yeah. Thanks a lot, Kojo, for taking my call. And I -- yeah, I actually was calling and I wanted to thank Delegate Barve, actually, for his strong support and leadership on bringing offshore wind to Maryland. And I -- you know, I think he's right. You know, given another year, hopefully, legislators will be able to analyze the issue in full and see that, you know, that this is really our best option for, you know, a stable price energy.

TOMAnd also we're going to need to meet the RPS, 20 percent by 2022.

SHERWOODWhat's the RPS? I apologize.

TOMSo, yeah, I just wanted to...

NNAMDIWhat's the RPS, Tom?

SHERWOODWhat's the RPS?

TOM...ask about that. But you already basically answered my question.

NNAMDITom, what's the RPS?

BARVEI can answer that.

SHERWOODOh, good.

NNAMDIOkay.

BARVEWhat we required is that power companies, when they sell electricity in the State of Maryland by the year 2022, I think, 20 percent of the electrons coming out of your wall socket have to be generated by renewable energy. And RPS stands for Renewable Portfolio Standard. If you look at the sources of energy as a portfolio, 20 percent has to be from renewable sources. And wind energy is a big part of achieving that goal.

NNAMDII guarantee you that's one acronym that Tom Sherwood is not going to remember.

SHERWOODI want to go back just briefly to the equal marriage matter because...

NNAMDISure.

SHERWOOD...you also passed the DREAM Act. And now there is an emotional and very strong and, so far, successful effort to get that on the ballot now. It's going to -- is it, in fact, has been officially ruled over to the ballot?

BARVEYes. Yes.

NNAMDIYes, it is.

SHERWOODThat's right. I've been on vacation. I couldn't remember. All right. So that's going to be on the ballot 2012, right?

BARVEYes, it is.

SHERWOODOkay. All right. What is -- the opposition to equal marriage, also, is quite strong. And I can envision that, should the Maryland General Assembly pass it this -- in this coming session, what is the timetable for the people who might want to go to a statewide referendum to repeal it?

NNAMDII am going to predict that before we even get off the air. There are people here who are already marching forward with the referendum on same-sex marriage...

BARVEWell, before...

NNAMDI...if the bill passes in Annapolis.

BARVEIt will pass and -- in my opinion. But let me just first say, with respect to the DREAM ACT...

NNAMDIPlease do.

BARVE...I think it's important for people -- for your listeners to understand what the law actually does. Let me just quickly describe what it does. First of all, it does not provide scholarship money to a single student. There won't be a student who will be cut a check to get money as some people have said. Number two, it requires the students or their guardians to file tax forms for the three years prior to going to a community college.

BARVEAnd step two is they have to spend two years in a community college. And at that point, only then can they apply for in-state tuition rates at the University of Maryland System. Throughout that entire time, they have to file taxes. And then, finally...

NNAMDISo you will know that they have been paying into the Maryland coffers.

BARVECorrect. Correct. And then, finally, these students who are -- again, let's understand. These are kids who were brought here -- they were brought here by their parents. They didn't make the decision to come here. They've graduated from college. If they are men, they have to or sign up for the draft. And then, finally, when they apply to the University of Maryland System, they can only compete for slots that are reserved for out-of-state students.

BARVESo they will not be competing for slots against...

SHERWOODAny in-state person.

BARVERight. Correct. Any in-state person. That is what the bill does.

SHERWOODSo -- but going back to the...

NNAMDI800-433-8850 is the number to call. Was that your understanding of the DREAM Act? 800-433-8850.

SHERWOODI just want to be clear about the referendum process.

BARVESure.

SHERWOODBut if you pass the bill in the next session -- even if it's at the last day, is there time to get that measure on the ballot...

BARVEWell, let me tell you what...

SHERWOOD...in the 2012?

BARVEWell, let me tell you what the rule is.

SHERWOODI know you don't want it to be on the ballot. But I'm just trying to understand the people who are opposed to it. I can't imagine they will just sit back.

BARVEWell, let me tell you what the rule is. The rule is when a bill passes the second chamber and goes to the governor's desk, the clock begins to tick for collecting signatures. So if the bill is pass in January, it gives a lot of time to get signatures, if the bill is passed in March or April, less time. Will it get the signatures to go on the ballot? I don't know. I mean, honestly, I think that there's a good chance that it may not.

BARVEBut there's also a good chance that it would pass. The voters in Maryland would uphold it.

SHERWOODAll right. Oh, I'm just thinking it will be an interesting year with the...

BARVEIt would be.

SHERWOOD...presidential race and then the DREAM Act on the ballot and then equal marriage.

BARVEThere are a lot of unpredictable variables that will be at play in November.

NNAMDIThere has been talk that this petition process is going to be the technique of choice from now on for the minority that loses in anything legislature, that the DREAM Act Petition was so efficient that it's going to serve as the road map for conservatives to block issues they don't like in the future. How do you see it?

BARVEWell, we'll see. I mean, the fact of the matter is the Democratic Party has a majority in both chambers, and we have the governor. And there are a lot of bills that we enact that conservatives may not like. But like any other tool in politics, you can't overuse it. It'll -- only time will tell, whether this becomes an automatic and easy thing for an opposition to use.

BARVEI -- my personal view is that you can use the Internet to organize large groups of people who are motivated. But on issues that are arcane, not so much.

NNAMDIYou don't see Maryland turning to California?

BARVEOh, God, no.

BARVEI mean, I...

NNAMDIJust about everything.

SHERWOODBut, you know, it's not just conservatives who can learn to use the Internet, put things on the ballot. You can also not just do referendums. You can do initiatives. I don't know if you...

BARVENo, we don't have any issue.

SHERWOODYou don't have any issues in Maryland?

BARVEWe can -- in Maryland, a bill that has passed that does not impact on the budget, that bill can be petitioned a referendum, but we don't have initiatives. You know, California, the reason they're an economic basket case is that the electorate there has the ability to increase spending and cut taxes. And every two years, they avail themselves of that opportunity.

NNAMDIHere is Allan in Frederick, Md. Allan, you are on the air. Go ahead, please.

ALLANYeah, I just wanted to thank the representative for clarifying what the DREAM Act actually is doing. I live in Frederick City. And I can tell you that during their petition drive that were done in downtown Frederick, there was a lot of misinformation, and they did not clarify at all exactly what this legislation is for. So thank you very much.

NNAMDIOkay.

BARVEYou're welcome.

NNAMDIThank you very much for your call. Here's Andrea in Rockville, Md. Andrea, you're on the air. Go ahead, please.

ANDREAHi, Kojo. This is Andrea. Thanks for taking my call, and, Delegate Barve, thanks for all your hard work in representing District 17. I'm one of your constituents. And as you're aware, Maryland's capital punishment system is riddled with racial and jurisdictional disparities, and every capital case prosecuted cost taxpayers about three times as much as prosecuting a life imprisonment homicide case.

ANDREAAs you also know, a 2009 bill narrowed the scope of the death penalty eligible cases. But the law is likely to be heavily litigated, which, of course, would cost more money to -- excuse me, taxpayers. In the last legislative session, more than 40 percent of the assembly, including your colleagues in District 17, Gilchrist and Simmons, co-sponsored the death penalty repeal bill, but you did not.

ANDREAI was wondering if there's any reason for this and where you stand on this issue.

BARVEI don't introduce. I don't co-sponsor a lot of bills, and I will -- I'm looking forward to an opportunity to vote against -- to vote to repeal the death penalty. I will say this, that my only concern has been that of people who commit acts of mass terror, and I -- you know, people who commit acts like on 9/11. I'm not -- in my mind, I'm not sure whether or not the death penalty applies in those very exceptional situations.

BARVEBut I suspect that, at the end of the day, I'm going to vote to abolish the death penalty.

NNAMDIAndrea, thank you very much for your call.

ANDREAThank you.

NNAMDIWe got this tweet from Darcy Spencer, one of Tom's colleagues at NBC 4. "What does Kumar Barve think of BG&E's shutting off customer's A/C during the heat wave? The PSC, Public Service Commission, is investigating."

BARVEYeah, I think that that is a potential public health threat that has to be investigated because, ordinarily -- you know, ordinarily, in times of extreme heat and cold, I believe the Public Service Commission and society general, has to a take a very, very guarded stance with respect to people, especially the frail elderly and people with children. I think that is something that should be investigated.

BARVEIn the end, however, it's important to recognize that if we make a decision as a society -- and I hope we do -- to make sure people don't die in heat or freeze in cold, that we as a society make that decision through our budget to allocate money for that purpose. Because, in the end, you know, somebody has to pay for all of this, and I would rather have it be a budget line item and have us talk about it logically and do it in that fashion.

BARVEBut in the interim, I think the Public Service Commission is correct to investigate this.

SHERWOODWould -- how would that work? Do we just decide that if there's a certain degree, a temperature, if it's 93 for three days in a row? I think -- Chuck Bell would speak in Channel 4, said in a tweet that this is the -- 25 days in July have been over 90 degrees.

BARVEYeah, I don't -- well, that's why we have a legislative process. We're going to have to have a public hearing and make a decision...

SHERWOODHave a standard.

BARVE...have a standard of some sort that is fair and equally applied throughout the state of Maryland.

NNAMDIWe're talking with Kumar Barve. He is the Majority Leader of the Maryland House of Delegates. He's a Democrat from Montgomery County. Tom Sherwood is our resident analyst. He's an NBC 4 reporter and a columnist for The Current Newspapers. If you have questions or comments for Kumar Barve, call us at 800-433-8850, or go to our website, kojoshow.org. Join the conversation there.

NNAMDIIt's hard to escape from all the gloom and doom talk about the Federal deficit ceiling and whether a default is going to cripple state and local governments, particularly in Virginia and Maryland. What concerns do you have about how all of this is going to play out? And what back-up plans do you think state officials in Maryland should be contemplating to deal with the default?

BARVEWell, first of all, Maryland, Virginia and D.C. are particularly vulnerable because of our proximity to the Federal government. And I'm very disheartened by the apparent attempt by the Tea Party individuals to play Russian roulette with the budget of the United States and the good credit worthiness of the United States.

BARVEI think it's dangerous and irresponsible and childlike, frankly, to just kind of wave off the issue and say, oh, you know, a default's not a problem. Well, the fact is America has 25 percent of the world's GDP. And people invest here because they trust us. And if our good credit is gone, that will be a hit to the American and the world economy. Now, as to the state of Maryland...

NNAMDIOn behalf of the Tea Party, allow me to say its members will say that this would be a wakeup call for the budget busters and the spenders of Congress of United States.

BARVEUh huh. You know what? These are the same people who voted for a trillion dollar unnecessary war in Iraq and trillions of dollars of unnecessary tax cuts for the wealthy and had no trouble whatsoever raising the debt limit to finance those policies (unintelligible)...

NNAMDIOn behalf of the Tea Party of -- no, go, ahead.

SHERWOOD(unintelligible) But, you know, President Obama on the left has been criticized for his concessions early on. And even this week, he didn't insist that there be some revenue as part of the budget deal. I can't -- one day, I think he's, like, losing ground, and I think, well, he's strong again. He had another press conference this morning.

BARVERight. I heard it.

SHERWOODI mean, it just seems to me that he's -- it's going to be an interesting campaign next year once they get -- do you think they'll settle something for middle of next week?

BARVEYou know, I honestly don't know. But let me tell you what the impact would be to Maryland and how we would have to deal with it. The impact could be potentially very serious. And if Maryland has to cut spending to keep its budget balanced, the process is this. The Board of Public Works is a body of three people: the governor, the treasurer and the comptroller of the state of Maryland.

BARVEAnd as a group, they can cut spending between General Assembly sessions. I think they can go as far as, like, 10 percent cut in budgetary spending. I can't remember the precise numbers. But basically, we may be, again, in a position where the Board of Public Works has to cut spending to keep the budget balanced. And for those who are listening, Maryland has had a balanced budget for well over 100 years.

BARVEWe've had a AAA bond rating for 50 years in a row, which may be a record. So we have a very good credit rating as a state -- as good a credit rating as a state can have. But we may be put into a position where we have to start slicing spending in very painful ways if the federal government screws up.

NNAMDIWhile we're on the topic of these big picture budget issues, it's my understanding, or rumor has it, or the scuttlebutt is -- we accept all of the above here -- that you're thinking about running to be the big budget guy in Maryland, state comptroller. Should I make the announcement for you now, or will you make it yourself?

BARVEWell, Peter Franchot is the current comptroller and...

SHERWOODTo his second term.

BARVEHe is in the second term, and he's strongly considering running for governor. And if the position is open, I'm virtually certain that I would run for that position if it were an open position. As you may know -- your callers may not know this, but our legislature is part-time. You have to have a day job. I'm an accountant, and I'm the chief financial officer for an environmental company in Rockville, Md.

BARVEAnd so, really, the position of comptroller is very much like being the chief -- elected chief financial officer of the state of Maryland. And I think there's a lot that that position could do that it is not doing. Most accountants listening to us right now are, right now, thinking of ways to save money for their businesses. I spend my time doing that.

BARVEAnd I think that's a function that the next comptroller, whoever it is, should spend more time exploring, rather than simply administering...

SHERWOODExploring saving money for the state?

BARVEWell, yeah, because, for example, there are a lot of new trends and procurement that a lot of state governments haven't gotten into. I mean, state governments have the ability to use -- state governments buy a lot of goods and services. And they have the ability to creatively use that power to get discounts. And Maryland's procurement process is a little fragmented. And I think it's something that needs to be investigated more closely.

SHERWOODWhen does -- what's the deadline for that? When does Peter -- when did he say he would make his decision or announcement?

BARVEWell, you know, when he and I spoke, he didn't -- he's looking at it, and -- but, you know, I think, like any other candidate, you have to decide sooner rather than later if you want to start putting together a campaign and drawing support. And I think that he's going to find that he'll have to do that. But I'm not going to speak for Peter.

NNAMDIIf Peter Franchot steps away, Kumar Barve will be going for that position. It's not a formal announcement, but, hey, it's as close as we can get to it. Remember you heard it here first.

SHERWOODIt's as good as.

NNAMDIHere is Kim in Manassas, Va. Kim, you're on the air. Go ahead, please.

KIMHi, Kojo, and hello, representative. Thank you for taking my call. I actually have something tangential, but I'd be curious as to your reaction. You had mentioned the federal problem with the debt ceiling and the rest of it. Honest to God, I think I have a non-partisan solution.

KIMIf everyone who is already being taxed had their taxes increased by 1 percent and if every budget that's currently being funded without exception across the board will reduce by 1 percent, would that not contribute significantly to lowering our debt and not affect any backroom dealings?

NNAMDIBut you mentioned the word tax and increase in the same sentence, Kim.

BARVEWell, let me say this, Kim. Actually, the philosophy you're espousing is precisely the solution. You know, during times of stress -- and this, by the way, in my career, this is the third recession I've actually served during. The solution always involves spreading the pain as evenly and as fairly as possible. No one segment of society should be singled out for the pain.

BARVEAnd that means, yeah, you've got to increase revenues. It means you do have to cut spending everywhere. But, most importantly, Kim, I think that, in a civil society, we all have to take ownership of the problem and realize that we all had a part in causing the problem. We all have to have a part in solving the problem.

BARVEAnd that means, yes, your type of proposal, whether it's that specifically or something else, is actually the only way for a group of adults to solve this problem.

NNAMDIKumar Barve, thank you so much for joining us.

BARVENot at all. It's great to be here.

NNAMDIKumar Barve is the majority leader of the Maryland House of Delegates. He's a Democrat from Montgomery County. You're listening to The Politics Hour. Tom Sherwood is our resident analyst. He's an NBC 4 reporter and a columnist for The Current Newspapers. Rend Smith of the City Paper, this week, wrote about Cathy Lanier, the Metropolitan Police chief of the District of Columbia, her citywide popularity and whether it's transferable to be running for office.

NNAMDIHere's the money quote, "The District's high speed demographic change has lots of politics watchers talking about the likelihood of a white mayor before too long. But the notable thing about Cathy Lanier is how different she seems from the other great white hopes. She's no streetcar-hugging, bike-lane-frequenting habitué of D.C.'s gentrification zone. To the contrary, she's a Ward 5 resident whose blue-collar affectations play best in the parts of town where her original patron, Fenty, got his you-know-what kicked."

SHERWOODWell, it wasn't her fault. Well, here's the deal. (sounds like) She's very popular as a police. I read the story, and Rend is a really good writer in the City Paper. And I read it, and I thought, okay. It's, like, five pages on my computer. So I wrote -- I read the first page. It was kind of laudatory and kind of -- I said, oop, he's setting her up. It's going to go crashing down. I read page two in my computer. Oop, still setting her up.

SHERWOODIt's going to look -- then page three was kind of, you know, she's new money and stuff and whatever problems. Then page four, page five, it's a -- she can frame this article. The City Paper is not, you know, doesn't do lot of stories that the subject wants to frame. But I think you could frame this one. It does capture her. I do not think I've ever heard the slightest heartbeat of elective politics in Cathy Lanier's DNA. Not one.

NNAMDISame here.

SHERWOODAnd so I don't think you'll see her running for office. I think she likes being chief. Her contract's up. She's going to -- next year, and I think she's going to stay as chief, barring any horrendous things that we don't know now. Kris Baumann is probably grating his teeth as the head of the union of fire -- police union, I say that. But, I mean, she has been successful because she's been accessible. She's exactly the opposite what Adrian Fenty was.

SHERWOODHe was -- he became cold, aloof and uncaring to the people's face. She's just the opposite. And when you're that way, you can have some mistakes and people will forgive them.

NNAMDIWe'll see if Cathy Lanier has a future in politics ala Anthony Williams who started out as the chief financial officer. A lot of people in the Washington region already know her as a member of the Arlington County Board. But the woman she is running to replace, Mary Margaret Whipple, is a person who commands political clout throughout the entire commonwealth. Joining us now in studio is Barbara Favola.

NNAMDIShe is a Democratic candidate for the Virginia Senate. She's running for the seat in commonwealth's 31st District, which is being vacated, as we mentioned, by outgoing Sen. Mary Margaret Whipple. The district includes parts of Arlington County. Barbara Favola is currently a member of the Arlington County Board. Thank you so much for joining us.

MS. BARBARA FAVOLAThank you, Kojo. It's my pleasure.

NNAMDIWhy are you running? Why do you want to be a senator?

FAVOLAOh, great question. Two reasons: first, I have 14 years of local experience on the Arlington County Board. And, so often, Richmond writes laws in a way that make it very difficult or impossible for local governments to actually implement the programs that our citizens need. So my perspective on how something is actually implemented at the ground level, I think, is well needed in Richmond.

FAVOLAAnd, secondly, I just have a vision for our state that I would like to participate in shaping, and that vision is a vision that's more progressive. I'd like to see more investments in K-12 education. I'd like to make higher education more affordable and accessible. I'm committed to the environment. I -- you know, I've been talking about the Chesapeake Bay 'cause I chair the Council of Governments, Ches Bay Committee.

FAVOLAAnd, of course, the big elephant in the room is always transportation when you're running for any office in Northern Virginia. And I've certainly had my opportunities to do some transportation planning at the local level. I'd like to see the state handle transportation differently. And I'd like to see a dedicated source of revenue for that.

SHERWOODYour opponent was on the -- was he on last week, just last week?

NNAMDILast week. Jaime Areizaga-Soto.

SHERWOODSoto -- describes himself as an unabashed liberal. He says it on his Face page. Are you?

FAVOLAOh, yes. I don't think you'd find anybody in my district who would say I'm not an unabashed liberal. But let me define what that is, just so we're all clear.

NNAMDIPlease.

SHERWOODOh, we'll define it -- we'll define it for you.

FAVOLAJust so we're all clear here.

SHERWOODWell, you know, the media would do it very well. Everyone has a different view on what that means. But you are...

FAVOLAI'm just so...

SHERWOODYou said progressive.

FAVOLAI said progressive. Absolutely. But on the social issues, which probably is what you're alluding to, I'm 100 percent pro-choice. I care about marriage equality. I care about a number of LGBT issues, you know, same-sex adoption. You know, I just believe the state shouldn't have a role in controlling individual choices.

SHERWOODYou know, the rest of the state of Virginia can be a little less friendly to those views. I mean, when you go to Richmond, do you think Northern Virginia is going to increase -- I don't know what redistricting is doing -- it's going to do in terms of getting more Northern Virginians in the legislatures. But, you know, people down in Roanoke and far Southwest Virginia are not necessarily…

FAVOLAWell, we will gain some, you know, hopefully, to delegate seats in the Senate seat. So we will gain more representation in -- from Northern Virginia. But your point is the values throughout the state are not the ones I just articulated. And I understand that that's probably true. But I have to believe that if you keep talking about these issues and you keep educating people and there are national efforts to educate people, eventually, we're going to make progress.

SHERWOODYou do have an appointment. I'm just very quick. I looked at your website. Mary Margaret Whipple has endorsed you.

FAVOLAYes.

SHERWOODOkay. Jim Miranda, congressman, has endorsed you.

FAVOLAYes.

SHERWOODRichard Saslaw, the leader of the Democrats in the Senate, has endorsed you.

FAVOLAYes.

SHERWOODPatsy Ticer has endorsed you.

FAVOLAMm hmm. Janet Howell.

SHERWOODJay Fisette.

FAVOLAYeah.

SHERWOODChris Zimmerman.

NNAMDIHow about who has not endorsed her? Maybe that's a shorter list.

SHERWOODI'm just speaking -- I was -- I have to tell you. I was a little bit surprised -- you sound like the establishment candidate. How can you be a liberal and be the establishment candidate?

FAVOLAOh, my goodness. You know, I think we need to set the record straight here.

SHERWOODAnd Sharon Bulova of Fairfax County, right?

FAVOLAIn Fairfax County. I've worked with these individuals, and we've actually accomplished some very important things for Northern Virginia. These are the -- these people care about the same issues I care about, and they care about problem solving. So there's a reason they've endorsed me. But I do want to say that, they, too, are progressive, and they've...

SHERWOODThis People's Republic of Arlington.

FAVOLAOf Arlington. Yeah, well, there's the People's Republic of Arlington. But I think Northern Virginia, more and more, is becoming progressive.

NNAMDIWhich Democrats would you think of as not progressive? What do you think of, say, Kumar Barve over in Maryland and how's he (unintelligible) ?

FAVOLAWell, I had the pleasure of listening to Kumar's interview with all of you. And I say...

NNAMDIHe's still in the room. He's morphed into Jack Evans.

FAVOLA...I was thinking, right on, you know? He's just -- he's in Maryland, which is right over the river. So there's hope. I know there's a big difference. The Potomac River is wide. But I was getting into Kumar's agenda.

NNAMDIYour opponent has been sending campaign mailers that basically tie you to Republicans like Bob McDonnell and Ken Cuccinelli. He's also called on you to quit the Arlington County Board last week over, well, this. Here is Alexander in Arlington, Va. Alexander, you're on the air. Go ahead, please.

ALEXANDERYes. Good afternoon, Ms. Favola. I guess you continue to refuse to address directly the allegations...

NNAMDIOh, I'm sorry. You need to put your headphones on, Barbara.

FAVOLAOh, excuse me one second. Okay.

NNAMDICould you start over again, Alexander?

ALEXANDERYeah, I'm sorry. I'm saying that, basically, you continue to refuse to address directly the allegations of repeated conflicts of interest due to, you know, these large campaign contributions that you've been receiving from developers and towing companies. And the recent example, I think, that was cited was the $2,500 donation that you accepted five days before you decided voting to raise towing fees on a split 3-2 board decision, which basically provided the towing company about a quarter of a million dollars.

ALEXANDERAnd, in response, your campaign basically said that it was solely based on the recommendation of the advisory committee. However, the recommendation was not binding. At least two out of the five board members voted against it. And, in fact, some of the other recommendations, all five of you rejected it.

NNAMDIOkay. Allow me to have Barbara Favola respond.

FAVOLASure. I'd be happy to respond. The towing question that came before the board was one -- had multiple parts to it. But let me just say we had an advisory committee with citizen representation on that committee, as well as other stakeholders. The county manager evaluated the request in an objective, professional way. And we also compared our towing fees with other jurisdictions in Northern Virginia.

FAVOLAAnd, as it turned out, we were lower. So, in my judgment -- and it was my judgment alone. I am a very independent thinker. And when I take a vote, the only person I answer to is myself and my conscience. I determined that it was appropriate to go forward with this increase. It had nothing at all to do with this donation. That's the fact. You can track it...

NNAMDIAnd your campaign has...

SHERWOOD(unintelligible) your donation was an untimely donation?

FAVOLAIt was an untimely donation. But let me make a point. Two years ago, I also voted to increase the towing fees, again, for very legitimate reasons. So it is what it is.

NNAMDIHow do you feel about the tactics of your opponents? I mentioned that he's been sending campaign mailers tying to Republicans like Bob McDonnell and Ken Cuccinelli. I'm pretty sure you don't necessarily see yourself on the same philosophical train as they are.

FAVOLAOh, no. I don't see myself on the same philosophical train, nor do the Republicans. I'm sure you know. In the Sun Gazette this morning, the leader of the GOP in Arlington came out and said there's just no similarity between Barbara Favola and Gov. McDonnell or Ken Cuccinelli. So, I mean, that's just a gross untruth. And it's, you know, unfortunate that the campaign would get down to that.

SHERWOODWhat do you think of your opponent?

FAVOLAWhat do I think of my opponent? Oh, I think he's a, you know, very nice, young, ambitious gentleman who, you know, I think, is looking for a job in the state Senate.

SHERWOODI'm just trying to see how Virginian she'll be in answering that question.

NNAMDIHe was looking for a low, scum dog response, is what he was looking for.

FAVOLAOh, well...

SHERWOODObviously, you know, in Virginia, there's a certain way of speaking and...

FAVOLAYeah, I don't have that Southern accent, but I am trying to adopt the charm.

NNAMDISherwood has it for you. Here is Dick in Arlington, Va. Dick, you're on the air. Go ahead, please.

SHERWOODNot Dick Saslaw, is it?

DICKHi. Thank you very much for taking my call. Sort of in the same vein, I live in Chain Bridge Forest, and we have a traffic coming project on North River Street, which the Arlington council, including Ms. Favola, voted for back in November, December. Fast forward, a bunch of neighbors opposed it. And Ms. Favola sort of changed her mind and climbed in on their side to try and get the project revised and, I would say, dumbed down.

DICKAnd all of this happened shortly after she received $1,000 campaign contribution from one of the neighbors. And I was wondering how she justifies her change in position.

NNAMDIBarbara Favola.

FAVOLAYeah, what the caller...

NNAMDII guess I should point out that the reason that people know where you got your campaign contributions from is because you publish them.

FAVOLAI was just going to say I am completely transparent about my donations, and my opponent has not been transparent. And I cannot self-finance. My opponent was self-financing his campaign, and we don't know where he earned the money to do that. So I'm at least being upfront and totally transparent with the voters. Let me go back and just say about the Chain Bridge issue.

FAVOLAThe VDOT -- that's the Virginia Department of Transportation -- actually reviewed that traffic coming proposal because part of it was going to be in the VDOT right-of-way, and they had suggested that changes be made. So that, in fact, is one of the reasons why I had rethought the traffic coming project and made some nips and tucks. But the decision, ultimately, was with the county manager.

NNAMDIDick, thank you very much for your call. We move on to Steve...

DICKThank you.

NNAMDI...in Alexandria, Va. Steve, you're on the air. Go ahead please.

STEVEHi. This is maybe kind of a just basic question about Virginia politics. But I have lived in the area for about a year. I moved from the Midwest and moved to kind of the corner of Arlington and Alexandria. And I just -- I absolutely love the area, although I -- normally, even though I registered back in the Midwest and voted in every election, you know, whether there's -- whatever is on the ballot, I didn't last year because I just don't know enough about the area.

STEVEAnd my big concern now is, given just a lot of the issues about the credit rating of the states, I'm concerned about, you know, polarization between rural and kind of the suburban northern area. And I wanted to know just what -- you know, how well do -- does the state legislature, you know, state legislature able to bridge that gap.

STEVEOr is there this kind of zero-sum politics that I used to see back home where people in, you know, rural Missouri would constantly point to the big cities and say, you know, big cities are taking away our money and the big cities would say the opposite about the rural area?

NNAMDINorthern Virginia versus downstate. In a lot of ways, Barbara Favola...

FAVOLAIn a lot of ways.

NNAMDI...that's what you'll be dealing with when -- if and when you get to the Senate.

FAVOLARight. Yeah, that's a very interesting question. And I just want to say that I believe or, certainly, I will act in the context of what is good for the entire state. I mean, you really want Virginia to succeed. You want Virginia to be one state where people -- everybody has an opportunity to get a good education, to get a good job. And, you know, Northern Virginia is a very wealthy pocket in the state.

FAVOLAAnd a fair number of -- a fair amount of the state coffers come from Northern Virginia, about 40 percent state money, and that money is spent, of course, usually, primarily through the educational, the transfer of dollars for funding K-12 education. So there certainly is a strong commitment to, I believe -- and I believe that most lawmakers take their jobs very seriously, and there's a strong commitment in trying to create the best possible state and not accentuate our divisions.

NNAMDIIf the Democrats keep the majority in the Virginia Senate, it's likely that you'll keep it by just a few votes. In this kind of environment, how do you think progress is going to get made on issues like transportation, for example? If you're a majority in the Senate, it's even smaller than it is now.

FAVOLAYeah, well, it's not going to be easy. But I believe that we, in fact, will make progress. I mean, after all, Northern Virginia is the economic engine of the state. And if we're going to continue to flourish, we have to address the transportation issue. And I think it's in the state's best interest for Northern Virginia to address the transportation issue.

SHERWOODWhat would you do in transportation? I covered the legislature in the early '80s. It shows how old I am. And the governors, even then, were just going to -- we got to do something about transportation in Northern Virginia. And now we are still...

NNAMDIThirty years later.

SHERWOOD...doing something about transportation. It sounds to me like the California highway system. What would you do if you could just write a check, or not a check, but just write a building program or two?

FAVOLAWell, you know, I'm on record supporting a penny increase in the gasoline tax, and that would be applied to the Northern Virginia area and then dedicated to transportation projects.

SHERWOODTo build more roads or repair the ones, expand the ones you have?

FAVOLAWell, I would say to support the transportation plans that are in place. So part of it would be building more roads. Part of it would be supporting what's in place. And, in large part, it would be giving a dedicated source of revenue to Metro operating. I just think -- we have to look at a more multimodal approach to our transportation systems. I mean, you know when you build a road, three years later, it's congested.

FAVOLASo the state is now moving not fast enough, but the state's moving in a way where they're going to evaluate different ways of providing transportation when you build a road, the rapid bus transit, the HOV, all that stuff.

NNAMDIOn your website, it says, Barbara Favola strongly believes that same-sex couples should enjoy the same rights, benefits and responsibilities as their straight counterparts. If you are elected to the Virginia Senate, how assertively, how aggressively are you likely to push that issue in what might be a not-so-friendly environment?

FAVOLAWell, that's an issue that, I think, is part of my core value structure. And I would be dedicated to individual rights and equality in any form or any way that they might come up in the General Assembly. I will say that, you know, we had that referendum a few years ago that actually, you know, banned gay marriage. I don't think, unfortunately, that that referendum would be overturned.

FAVOLASo I think, in the General Assembly, we have to decide exactly how we're going to strategize to make progress in these areas, but I think we have to make progress each year.

NNAMDIBarbara Favola is a Democratic candidate for the Virginia Senate. She's running for the seat in the commonwealth's 31st District, which includes parts of Arlington County. She's currently a member of the Arlington County Board. The primary takes place on Aug. 23. Barbara Favola, thank you for joining us. Good luck to you.

FAVOLAThank you. Thank you.

NNAMDITom Sherwood mentioned earlier on that he keeps one hand free whenever he is riding his bicycle. In case he thinks I am prejudiced, Barbara Favola, if you take a look at this picture, you can see what Tom Sherwood does with his free hand when he's riding his bicycle.

SHERWOODI don't know. I have not seen this picture. I am going to bike this afternoon.

NNAMDIIs he punching somebody or is he not punching somebody in that photo? Come on. Kumar Barve, you're looking at it also. He does seem to be punching. Pass it on.

BARVEIt looks like an emotional episode of some sort.

FAVOLAHe looks a little aggressive.

NNAMDIAre you punching somebody?

SHERWOODYou know...

FAVOLAHe looks a little aggressive.

SHERWOOD...I just -- I would just tell you one word.

NNAMDIWhat?

SHERWOODPhotoshop.

NNAMDIIt's Alberto Contador of Spain who is, in fact, punching somebody with his free hand in that photo.

SHERWOODI'm nonviolent. I'm not nonviolent.

NNAMDIThank you all for listening. I'm Kojo Nnamdi.